WEBVTT 00:00:00.001 --> 00:00:01.760 Have you heard of the package rich? 00:00:01.760 --> 00:00:06.260 This library allows you to create, well, rich terminal-based UIs in Python. 00:00:06.260 --> 00:00:09.960 When you think of what you can typically build with basic print statements, 00:00:09.960 --> 00:00:11.420 they may seem quite limited. 00:00:11.420 --> 00:00:15.620 But with rich, imagine justified tables, progress bars, 00:00:15.620 --> 00:00:17.900 rendering of markdown, and way more. 00:00:17.900 --> 00:00:21.520 This is one of the fastest-growing projects in the Python space these days, 00:00:21.520 --> 00:00:24.420 and the creator, Will McGoogan, is here to give us the whole history 00:00:24.420 --> 00:00:28.540 and even a peek at the future of rich and a follow-on library called Textual. 00:00:29.240 --> 00:00:34.700 This is Talk Python To Me, episode 336, recorded October 13th, 2021. 00:00:34.700 --> 00:00:50.420 Welcome to Talk Python To Me, a weekly podcast on Python. 00:00:50.420 --> 00:00:52.160 This is your host, Michael Kennedy. 00:00:52.160 --> 00:00:54.420 Follow me on Twitter, where I'm @mkennedy, 00:00:54.420 --> 00:00:58.340 and keep up with the show and listen to past episodes at talkpython.fm. 00:00:58.480 --> 00:01:01.360 And follow the show on Twitter via at Talk Python. 00:01:01.360 --> 00:01:05.060 We've started streaming most of our episodes live on YouTube. 00:01:05.060 --> 00:01:08.800 Subscribe to our YouTube channel over at talkpython.fm/youtube 00:01:08.800 --> 00:01:12.580 to get notified about upcoming shows and be part of that episode. 00:01:12.580 --> 00:01:17.760 This episode is brought to you by Shortcut, formerly known as clubhouse.io, 00:01:17.760 --> 00:01:19.840 and us over at Talk Python Training. 00:01:19.840 --> 00:01:22.780 And the transcripts are brought to you by Assembly AI. 00:01:24.160 --> 00:01:25.980 Will, welcome to Talk Python To Me. 00:01:25.980 --> 00:01:26.380 Thank you. 00:01:26.380 --> 00:01:28.620 It's fantastic to finally have you on the show. 00:01:28.620 --> 00:01:32.400 I feel like we've talked a lot about the work that you've been doing many times. 00:01:32.400 --> 00:01:36.380 Not so much on Talk Python because we're more focused on a single topic. 00:01:36.380 --> 00:01:41.800 But even so, I believe, you know, at the end, I always ask for some project that needs attention, 00:01:41.800 --> 00:01:43.000 needs some sort of shout out. 00:01:43.000 --> 00:01:45.680 And, you know, I believe Rich has come up more than once. 00:01:45.740 --> 00:01:48.400 I think Textual has come up at least once there. 00:01:48.400 --> 00:01:51.780 So the prior guests of the show have been fans. 00:01:51.780 --> 00:01:53.920 And I know the audience is a big fan. 00:01:53.920 --> 00:01:56.440 So, yeah, congrats on all the progress there. 00:01:56.440 --> 00:01:57.120 Great. Thanks. 00:01:57.120 --> 00:01:58.920 Yeah, I really appreciate the coverage. 00:01:58.920 --> 00:02:02.140 You probably increased my star count by a few thousand. 00:02:02.140 --> 00:02:06.040 Well, I do want to talk about that because this project is super popular. 00:02:06.040 --> 00:02:12.260 And as we get into it, I think it's going to be fun to explore some of the things that you felt were key to that. 00:02:12.260 --> 00:02:18.700 And if this is the first time people are hearing about Rich, you definitely want to check out some of the screenshots. 00:02:18.700 --> 00:02:26.380 Maybe I'll do something fun, like make part of the show, have the show notes or the podcast player have some screenshots from the various sections. 00:02:26.380 --> 00:02:28.280 Like as I said, I'll see if I can make that happen. 00:02:28.280 --> 00:02:33.720 But before we get to all that, before we dive into Rich and Textual and all the other things, let's talk about you. 00:02:33.720 --> 00:02:37.840 How did you get into programming and how did you find yourself doing all this open source Python? 00:02:37.840 --> 00:02:39.220 How did I get into programming? 00:02:39.220 --> 00:02:39.780 Oh, OK. 00:02:39.780 --> 00:02:44.320 So as a kid in the 80s, I guess, I had a Spectrum 48K computer. 00:02:44.320 --> 00:02:51.360 It was a little plastic thing you plugged into your TV and you could create very simple animations and little games. 00:02:51.360 --> 00:02:52.780 And I think from there I was hooked. 00:02:52.780 --> 00:02:53.440 Oh, fantastic. 00:02:53.440 --> 00:02:57.660 That's just something about me that connected with programming, I guess. 00:02:57.660 --> 00:03:00.080 What's interesting is those games were so basic, right? 00:03:00.080 --> 00:03:03.720 They weren't like 3D, VR, oh my gosh, I'm there. 00:03:03.720 --> 00:03:08.600 Or some of the flashy, even the flashy mobile apps, mobile games these days. 00:03:08.600 --> 00:03:13.900 But something about those early, early games really captured the imagination, didn't they? 00:03:13.900 --> 00:03:14.160 Yeah. 00:03:14.160 --> 00:03:18.020 And the fact that they were so limiting had to make you a little bit creative. 00:03:18.020 --> 00:03:21.600 So it encouraged creativity because you couldn't do much of anything. 00:03:21.600 --> 00:03:24.160 So you had to make the best of what you got. 00:03:24.240 --> 00:03:26.100 So it encouraged you to experiment. 00:03:26.100 --> 00:03:29.940 And I think it was a great way to get people into programming again, I think. 00:03:29.940 --> 00:03:30.140 Yeah. 00:03:30.140 --> 00:03:32.180 Until recently, we haven't had that. 00:03:32.180 --> 00:03:35.440 And I think the Raspberry Pi does that to some extent, which is a great thing. 00:03:35.440 --> 00:03:35.780 Yeah. 00:03:35.780 --> 00:03:41.340 It sort of reaches out to the real world in a more simplistic way, kind of repeating that cycle, right? 00:03:41.340 --> 00:03:41.720 Yeah. 00:03:41.720 --> 00:03:42.220 Yeah. 00:03:42.240 --> 00:03:48.700 And it just allows people access to programming in a very kind of accessible form for children, I guess. 00:03:48.700 --> 00:03:55.340 So I think the next generation in 20 years will be citing Raspberry Pi as how they got into programming. 00:03:55.340 --> 00:03:55.820 Interesting. 00:03:55.820 --> 00:03:56.140 Yeah. 00:03:56.140 --> 00:03:59.120 I built a robot the first time around or something like that, right? 00:03:59.120 --> 00:03:59.540 Yeah. 00:03:59.800 --> 00:04:04.080 Instead of wanting to play a game or script a game out or something like that. 00:04:04.080 --> 00:04:04.800 Interesting. 00:04:04.800 --> 00:04:08.580 And, you know, a lot of times I ask people, okay, well, what are you doing now? 00:04:08.580 --> 00:04:13.040 They're like, oh, I'm, you know, head of data science at a company such and such. 00:04:13.040 --> 00:04:20.300 You've taken a very interesting, and I suspect a lot of people will be quite jealous of what you're up to these days, right? 00:04:20.300 --> 00:04:21.060 What are you doing now? 00:04:21.060 --> 00:04:21.420 Yeah. 00:04:21.420 --> 00:04:24.320 So up until recently, I was contracting. 00:04:24.320 --> 00:04:26.220 But I ended my contract. 00:04:26.300 --> 00:04:28.140 I'm going to take a year out. 00:04:28.140 --> 00:04:30.220 Well, possibly a year. 00:04:30.220 --> 00:04:31.060 It depends how much. 00:04:31.060 --> 00:04:32.840 It depends how things go. 00:04:32.840 --> 00:04:38.280 But the idea is to work on open source, specifically rich and textual. 00:04:38.280 --> 00:04:40.920 There are other projects that take my fancy as well. 00:04:40.920 --> 00:04:44.280 Anything that I can contribute to might try my hand at it. 00:04:44.280 --> 00:04:50.780 It's not entirely selfless because I do think there might be commercial applications for textual down the line. 00:04:51.600 --> 00:04:57.560 But certainly for this first six months, it'll be just focusing on just making it the best thing you can. 00:04:57.560 --> 00:04:59.140 Making it a super solid foundation. 00:04:59.140 --> 00:05:00.640 Yeah, absolutely. 00:05:00.640 --> 00:05:07.280 Well, I don't think it's going to take that much to get some things in place to make this long term for you. 00:05:07.280 --> 00:05:13.700 You know, people can go, if their company or individually they're finding huge value, they could go to GitHub and sponsor you. 00:05:14.140 --> 00:05:16.740 There's enterprise stuff that can be set up. 00:05:16.740 --> 00:05:19.880 We'll dive a little bit into that more possibly later as well. 00:05:19.880 --> 00:05:21.200 But I wish you a lot of luck. 00:05:21.200 --> 00:05:30.820 But I think with the traction that you're getting and the new things like I really find GitHub's sponsor feature to be something of a game changer. 00:05:30.820 --> 00:05:31.300 Yeah. 00:05:31.440 --> 00:05:34.320 I remember looking back, you'd see, oh, here's a popular project. 00:05:34.320 --> 00:05:37.160 Maybe it's not even an open source library, but it's like an app. 00:05:37.160 --> 00:05:40.000 And it's like, click here to thank the developer on PayPal. 00:05:40.000 --> 00:05:40.780 Right. 00:05:40.780 --> 00:05:41.120 And just. 00:05:41.120 --> 00:05:43.700 There was a little bit of a barrier to entry. 00:05:43.700 --> 00:05:44.260 Yeah. 00:05:44.260 --> 00:05:45.260 And maybe you do it once. 00:05:45.260 --> 00:05:45.440 Right. 00:05:45.440 --> 00:05:49.000 But with GitHub, you can say, I just kind of want to say, I want this to keep going. 00:05:49.000 --> 00:05:51.160 So here's two dollars a month. 00:05:51.160 --> 00:05:58.480 And if, you know, not that many people who find it valuable send in a couple of bucks a month, all of a sudden it starts to be a foundation that you can really build from. 00:05:58.480 --> 00:05:58.820 Yeah. 00:05:58.820 --> 00:06:08.820 It could build up and be something which is sustainable and sustain open source because so many people benefit from open source, including big companies, big corporations. 00:06:08.820 --> 00:06:13.060 But a lot of these developers are doing it in their spare time for the love of it. 00:06:13.060 --> 00:06:18.900 And they haven't asked for funding before, but a lot of them deserve funding. 00:06:18.900 --> 00:06:30.080 Certainly lots of projects which could really use funding to make sure they keep going, to make sure that the software that we all use is still available in a year, two years and five years down the line. 00:06:30.080 --> 00:06:30.680 Yeah. 00:06:30.680 --> 00:06:39.000 Otherwise, we're going to end up in a place with like open SSL where there's one person who maintains it and a quarter of the world seems to be built directly upon it. 00:06:39.000 --> 00:06:39.180 Right. 00:06:39.180 --> 00:06:39.620 Remember that? 00:06:39.620 --> 00:06:39.960 Yeah. 00:06:39.960 --> 00:06:41.360 It was a huge problem. 00:06:41.360 --> 00:06:42.440 Heartbleed, was it called? 00:06:42.720 --> 00:06:44.200 Which is a Heartbleed? 00:06:44.200 --> 00:06:44.580 Yeah. 00:06:44.580 --> 00:06:45.320 Heartbleed, that's right. 00:06:45.320 --> 00:06:46.300 Yeah. 00:06:46.300 --> 00:06:47.460 Which is a great name for a bug. 00:06:47.460 --> 00:06:49.440 It really is. 00:06:49.440 --> 00:06:50.620 Why wasn't this fixed? 00:06:50.620 --> 00:06:54.400 Well, there's one person who does it in their spare time, but everything depends on it. 00:06:54.400 --> 00:06:57.200 Yeah, but there's still one person who does it in their spare time. 00:06:57.200 --> 00:06:57.520 Yeah. 00:06:57.520 --> 00:07:01.960 And yeah, it's just really hard to put that kind of energy and responsiveness into it. 00:07:01.960 --> 00:07:02.440 All right. 00:07:02.440 --> 00:07:02.980 Fantastic. 00:07:02.980 --> 00:07:07.120 So let's start with textual, which I had on the screen, but let's start with rich. 00:07:07.120 --> 00:07:11.660 Rich is where things got started amongst rich and textual, right? 00:07:11.660 --> 00:07:12.700 If I remember the history. 00:07:12.700 --> 00:07:13.040 Yeah. 00:07:13.040 --> 00:07:14.240 Rich was first. 00:07:14.240 --> 00:07:16.120 That's about two years ago that I started that. 00:07:16.120 --> 00:07:16.580 Yeah. 00:07:16.580 --> 00:07:17.000 Cool. 00:07:17.000 --> 00:07:22.300 So tell people, you know, a lot of people have heard of rich, but maybe tell folks out there, 00:07:22.300 --> 00:07:23.840 how would you describe it? 00:07:23.840 --> 00:07:27.500 You know, it's, we've had ways to sort of print stuff nicer. 00:07:27.660 --> 00:07:29.200 We've got pretty print Python. 00:07:29.200 --> 00:07:33.420 We've got colorama where you can put color into your, your terminal, but this takes it 00:07:33.420 --> 00:07:35.040 to an absolutely new level. 00:07:35.040 --> 00:07:36.820 So tell us, tell us about rich. 00:07:36.820 --> 00:07:37.160 Yeah. 00:07:37.160 --> 00:07:40.840 that makes it difficult to describe sometimes when people ask me what it does, because it 00:07:40.840 --> 00:07:42.260 does quite a lot of things. 00:07:42.260 --> 00:07:47.460 but it's all under the umbrella of writing more sophisticated outputs to the terminal. 00:07:47.460 --> 00:07:53.140 At the basic level is you can set colors and you can set styles like bold and italic. 00:07:53.140 --> 00:07:58.360 the next level up, it'll do word wrap and it'll also word wrap the style. 00:07:58.360 --> 00:08:00.720 So you can apply bold and then, then word wrap it. 00:08:00.720 --> 00:08:03.360 And then we have things like tables. 00:08:03.560 --> 00:08:08.140 There's quite sophisticated table support, which are quite close to HTML tables. 00:08:08.140 --> 00:08:10.640 You can, you know, put things in cells. 00:08:10.640 --> 00:08:13.760 You've got a header row, you've got a little divider, and then you've got the data. 00:08:13.760 --> 00:08:14.000 Yeah. 00:08:14.000 --> 00:08:14.460 Yeah. 00:08:14.460 --> 00:08:17.480 And then you can draw lines around it and change the styles. 00:08:17.480 --> 00:08:22.060 And, it's, it's all, you even have like alternating rows, right? 00:08:22.060 --> 00:08:25.500 So it kind of helps you line across, which is pretty neat. 00:08:25.500 --> 00:08:25.940 Exactly. 00:08:25.940 --> 00:08:26.200 Yeah. 00:08:26.200 --> 00:08:27.860 So it's, it's quite sophisticated. 00:08:27.860 --> 00:08:29.280 It's all composable. 00:08:29.280 --> 00:08:33.420 So if I've got a table, I can obviously put text inside it, but I can put another 00:08:33.420 --> 00:08:37.840 table inside it, or I could put a progress bar inside it or syntax highlighting inside 00:08:37.840 --> 00:08:38.000 it. 00:08:38.000 --> 00:08:41.860 So the idea is that, rather than like lots of separate libraries, which don't work 00:08:41.860 --> 00:08:45.080 well together, which I think was a situation that we had previously. 00:08:45.080 --> 00:08:46.520 Now they all work together. 00:08:46.520 --> 00:08:49.720 They fit inside each other and they integrate quite well. 00:08:49.720 --> 00:08:50.000 Right. 00:08:50.000 --> 00:08:53.300 So you could take your formatting and put it in your word wrap and put it inside of a 00:08:53.300 --> 00:08:54.520 table cell or something like that. 00:08:54.520 --> 00:08:54.920 Exactly. 00:08:54.920 --> 00:08:55.180 Yeah. 00:08:55.180 --> 00:08:55.740 Yeah. 00:08:55.740 --> 00:08:56.060 Yeah. 00:08:56.060 --> 00:08:56.640 Yeah. 00:08:56.640 --> 00:08:56.800 Yeah. 00:08:56.800 --> 00:09:00.660 So one of the things that struck me, well, there's a couple of things, but one of them 00:09:00.660 --> 00:09:03.020 is just how popular Rich is. 00:09:03.280 --> 00:09:03.600 Right. 00:09:03.600 --> 00:09:05.820 It's almost 30,000 GitHub stars. 00:09:05.820 --> 00:09:11.680 That's, that's close to FastAPI level of popularity and not that far behind Flask and 00:09:11.680 --> 00:09:11.940 Django. 00:09:11.940 --> 00:09:13.560 That's a really, really popular. 00:09:13.560 --> 00:09:14.940 When did you create this? 00:09:14.940 --> 00:09:15.600 Two years ago. 00:09:15.600 --> 00:09:16.420 Yeah. 00:09:16.420 --> 00:09:16.780 Yeah. 00:09:16.780 --> 00:09:24.160 So I guess on the timeline, similar age to FastAPI, but much younger than Flask and Django, 00:09:24.160 --> 00:09:25.680 if I'm comparing them to those. 00:09:25.680 --> 00:09:30.340 And over here, it says on your page, you have 2 million downloads a month. 00:09:30.340 --> 00:09:31.340 That's pretty incredible. 00:09:31.340 --> 00:09:31.700 Yeah. 00:09:31.700 --> 00:09:32.960 That's, that's, that's pretty crazy. 00:09:33.080 --> 00:09:35.560 I think quite a few of those are automated. 00:09:35.560 --> 00:09:37.420 They're from CI systems. 00:09:37.420 --> 00:09:37.740 Yeah. 00:09:37.740 --> 00:09:37.940 Yeah. 00:09:37.940 --> 00:09:41.220 But I do see that, that rising quite, quite steadily. 00:09:41.220 --> 00:09:41.560 Yeah. 00:09:41.560 --> 00:09:47.840 I wonder how many of the CI systems just in general out there do caching at some level where it 00:09:47.840 --> 00:09:48.540 wouldn't register. 00:09:48.540 --> 00:09:48.860 Right. 00:09:48.940 --> 00:09:52.380 you know, I pip install a thing I've already installed and it's a certain version. 00:09:52.380 --> 00:09:53.900 And it'll just say using cached version. 00:09:53.900 --> 00:09:54.160 Mm-hmm. 00:09:54.160 --> 00:09:54.540 Mm-hmm. 00:09:54.540 --> 00:09:55.020 Right. 00:09:55.020 --> 00:09:55.060 Right. 00:09:55.060 --> 00:10:00.200 versus if you create a brand new Docker image and then the next thing you do is install 00:10:00.200 --> 00:10:03.140 your, you know, pip install your dependencies inside of your Docker. 00:10:03.140 --> 00:10:04.260 That's a true download, right? 00:10:04.260 --> 00:10:05.940 Because that machine is totally fresh. 00:10:05.940 --> 00:10:06.300 Yeah. 00:10:06.300 --> 00:10:07.040 Yeah. 00:10:07.040 --> 00:10:08.300 So it's, it's hard to tell. 00:10:08.300 --> 00:10:08.660 Yeah. 00:10:08.660 --> 00:10:09.340 I don't know. 00:10:09.340 --> 00:10:11.520 Do you have any feel for what that breakdown is? 00:10:11.520 --> 00:10:12.840 To be honest, I'm not sure. 00:10:12.840 --> 00:10:15.060 That site doesn't give you the breakdown. 00:10:15.060 --> 00:10:20.120 To be honest, what I would be interested in is how many developers typed pip install rich 00:10:20.120 --> 00:10:22.260 in that month. 00:10:22.260 --> 00:10:24.360 You know, how many human beings played with it. 00:10:24.360 --> 00:10:25.520 That would interest me more. 00:10:26.160 --> 00:10:29.720 But suffice to say, quite a lot of people have used it. 00:10:29.720 --> 00:10:30.280 It is quite a lot. 00:10:30.280 --> 00:10:30.780 Downloading it. 00:10:30.780 --> 00:10:31.080 Yeah. 00:10:31.080 --> 00:10:31.400 Yeah. 00:10:31.400 --> 00:10:35.620 I'm sure it's changed the way that you think about working on the library and whatnot. 00:10:35.620 --> 00:10:36.160 Right. 00:10:36.160 --> 00:10:39.400 You know, it's, oh, maybe this might, might destable it. 00:10:39.400 --> 00:10:41.580 This might cause a problem or this might cause confusion. 00:10:41.580 --> 00:10:43.820 It's one thing to do that for a thousand people. 00:10:43.820 --> 00:10:45.520 It's another to do that for two million. 00:10:45.520 --> 00:10:47.060 That's right. 00:10:47.060 --> 00:10:47.700 Right. 00:10:47.700 --> 00:10:48.380 It's, I am. 00:10:48.380 --> 00:10:49.820 You're going to hear about it, I bet. 00:10:49.820 --> 00:10:50.400 Absolutely. 00:10:50.400 --> 00:10:53.820 I didn't follow Semver very strictly originally. 00:10:54.100 --> 00:10:58.720 I always plan to use Semver and people are starting to use it. 00:10:58.720 --> 00:11:00.780 And I made, I made a breaking change. 00:11:00.780 --> 00:11:03.340 And I didn't think anyone was using this particular feature. 00:11:03.340 --> 00:11:06.520 So I didn't increase the major version number. 00:11:06.520 --> 00:11:10.960 And then a couple of days later, I got an issue, someone telling me off. 00:11:10.960 --> 00:11:12.680 Quite rightly so. 00:11:12.680 --> 00:11:13.360 Oh man. 00:11:13.360 --> 00:11:15.280 For not warning them about a breaking feature. 00:11:15.280 --> 00:11:17.900 So since then, I've been very, very strict. 00:11:17.900 --> 00:11:19.460 It's a version 10. 00:11:19.460 --> 00:11:24.020 And that's because I've made 10 changes, breaking changes to the API. 00:11:24.300 --> 00:11:25.260 They're actually quite small. 00:11:25.260 --> 00:11:30.980 You know, it might just be one signature and one method, but that requires a major version 00:11:30.980 --> 00:11:31.460 change. 00:11:31.460 --> 00:11:31.760 Right. 00:11:31.760 --> 00:11:34.860 But at that scale, obviously, that's still going to affect it. 00:11:34.860 --> 00:11:37.120 That people, you're going to hear about it and whatnot, right? 00:11:37.120 --> 00:11:37.480 Exactly. 00:11:37.480 --> 00:11:39.000 I don't want to break anyone's code. 00:11:39.000 --> 00:11:40.260 I don't want to give them a bad day. 00:11:40.260 --> 00:11:42.820 So I'm very strict about that kind of thing. 00:11:42.820 --> 00:11:43.240 Yeah. 00:11:43.240 --> 00:11:43.720 Fantastic. 00:11:43.980 --> 00:11:46.680 And also people should pin their versions, right? 00:11:46.680 --> 00:11:53.800 So on the flip side, they can also make sure that what they're working on is nice and stable, 00:11:53.800 --> 00:11:54.020 right? 00:11:54.020 --> 00:11:54.360 Yeah. 00:11:54.360 --> 00:11:55.360 A lot of people don't. 00:11:55.360 --> 00:11:59.680 I do search GitHub sometimes for rich and I look at their PyTummel. 00:11:59.680 --> 00:12:00.060 What is it? 00:12:00.060 --> 00:12:01.320 PyProjectTummel. 00:12:01.320 --> 00:12:02.120 Yeah. 00:12:02.120 --> 00:12:02.520 PyProjectTummel. 00:12:02.520 --> 00:12:02.660 Yeah. 00:12:03.220 --> 00:12:06.840 And a lot of people don't pin their rich version. 00:12:06.840 --> 00:12:10.280 They'll just be rich and it shouldn't break too much. 00:12:10.280 --> 00:12:13.380 And often it's a hobby project, so it's not the biggest deal. 00:12:13.380 --> 00:12:13.640 Right. 00:12:13.640 --> 00:12:14.800 It really depends. 00:12:14.800 --> 00:12:16.460 Like it's one of the things I struggle with. 00:12:16.460 --> 00:12:18.660 So I do a lot of course development, right? 00:12:18.660 --> 00:12:23.220 And I don't necessarily want to pin people to the oldest version. 00:12:23.220 --> 00:12:27.480 I'd rather let them have the newest stuff so it exactly matches the documentation. 00:12:27.480 --> 00:12:30.880 If they go check it these days and stuff, if they go back, you know, six months and watch 00:12:30.880 --> 00:12:33.400 the video or check out the demo app. 00:12:33.400 --> 00:12:35.960 But at the same time, there's a chance of that instability. 00:12:35.960 --> 00:12:37.220 There's always this tension, right? 00:12:37.220 --> 00:12:41.380 And I guess it depends on what the use case of that app or that library is. 00:12:41.380 --> 00:12:41.720 Yeah. 00:12:41.720 --> 00:12:42.240 Yeah. 00:12:42.240 --> 00:12:43.340 It's tricky to say. 00:12:43.340 --> 00:12:48.520 The less critical it is for your business or your project, the more you can relax. 00:12:48.520 --> 00:12:51.560 If it's a tutorial, maybe it doesn't matter quite so much. 00:12:51.560 --> 00:12:55.520 But if it's critical infrastructure, then you want to pin. 00:12:55.520 --> 00:12:57.460 Yeah. 00:12:57.460 --> 00:12:58.060 Yeah. 00:12:58.060 --> 00:13:00.360 For my web apps, versions are pinned. 00:13:00.360 --> 00:13:01.300 Super strict. 00:13:01.300 --> 00:13:05.180 Even the dependencies of the dependencies, like the transitive closure of the dependencies 00:13:05.180 --> 00:13:05.860 are all pinned. 00:13:05.860 --> 00:13:06.120 Yeah. 00:13:06.120 --> 00:13:07.880 On like little demo apps and stuff. 00:13:07.880 --> 00:13:09.040 Like it's just wide open. 00:13:09.040 --> 00:13:10.760 So I think it depends. 00:13:10.760 --> 00:13:11.160 All right. 00:13:11.160 --> 00:13:15.120 So out in the audience, we have Hybotics says, Will, this looks really good to me. 00:13:15.120 --> 00:13:16.020 I'm looking at repo now. 00:13:16.020 --> 00:13:19.560 So not everyone has previously heard of Rich, which is awesome. 00:13:19.560 --> 00:13:22.820 Oh, it's good to know there's a few people left. 00:13:25.000 --> 00:13:25.560 That's right. 00:13:25.560 --> 00:13:25.800 Yeah. 00:13:25.800 --> 00:13:28.480 I suspect there's actually a lot of people. 00:13:28.480 --> 00:13:30.380 So who haven't heard it before. 00:13:30.380 --> 00:13:36.000 Again, check out the screenshots because if you think, oh, here's something that sort of 00:13:36.000 --> 00:13:41.840 enhances terminal output that completely undersells the level of what you've pulled off here. 00:13:41.840 --> 00:13:44.560 And that's only before we even talk about textual, right? 00:13:44.700 --> 00:13:50.120 Let's talk about compatibility because one of the things I find with these sort of nicer 00:13:50.120 --> 00:13:54.220 terminal output things is like, this works fantastic on POSIX systems. 00:13:54.220 --> 00:13:55.700 Oh, but you better not be on Windows. 00:13:55.700 --> 00:14:00.000 Or if you're a data scientist, you like Jupyter Notebooks, you can forget about it. 00:14:00.000 --> 00:14:02.700 But if you really want to run this thing, like, so what's the story? 00:14:02.700 --> 00:14:03.580 Like, where can I use this? 00:14:03.580 --> 00:14:04.440 Just about everywhere. 00:14:04.440 --> 00:14:07.160 Linux, OSX, Windows, and Jupyter. 00:14:07.740 --> 00:14:13.280 It started out, it was Linux OSX because that is the easiest platform to develop this kind 00:14:13.280 --> 00:14:13.900 of stuff for. 00:14:13.900 --> 00:14:15.660 Windows is a bit of a black sheep. 00:14:15.660 --> 00:14:18.520 It didn't quite work as is. 00:14:18.520 --> 00:14:20.240 Windows is getting better though, right? 00:14:20.240 --> 00:14:24.180 I mean, when it was cmd.exe, it was like, oh boy, this is really different. 00:14:24.180 --> 00:14:27.080 But the new Windows terminal, I'm really digging it. 00:14:27.080 --> 00:14:30.740 You know, the new PowerShell, the things like, oh, my Posh extensions. 00:14:30.740 --> 00:14:34.040 I can feel much more at home on Windows on the terminal than I used to. 00:14:34.040 --> 00:14:34.800 Yeah, yeah. 00:14:34.800 --> 00:14:36.980 So the new Windows terminal is much better. 00:14:36.980 --> 00:14:43.300 Rich doesn't have to do quite so many, doesn't have to jump so many hoops to get Windows support. 00:14:43.300 --> 00:14:46.400 In fact, it just runs kind of as is. 00:14:46.400 --> 00:14:51.020 It still supports the older Windows terminal, which does have a few issues. 00:14:51.020 --> 00:14:53.280 It doesn't, it has very limited colors. 00:14:53.280 --> 00:14:54.020 That's brave. 00:14:54.020 --> 00:14:54.380 Yeah. 00:14:54.380 --> 00:14:56.200 But I guess maybe you want to, right? 00:14:56.200 --> 00:15:01.320 If you're going to give the app to somebody, you can't really package up the terminal they're going to run it in. 00:15:01.320 --> 00:15:04.100 So you probably want to have your best possible experience on. 00:15:04.100 --> 00:15:08.380 To be honest, most people are still going to be running cmd.exe, even if they shouldn't. 00:15:08.380 --> 00:15:09.500 Yeah, exactly. 00:15:09.500 --> 00:15:09.920 Yeah. 00:15:09.920 --> 00:15:15.280 I mean, I could just tell them to install Windows terminal, but that kind of goes against the ethos of this library. 00:15:15.280 --> 00:15:19.700 I just want it to work so that people don't have to think about what it runs on. 00:15:19.700 --> 00:15:19.960 Yeah. 00:15:19.960 --> 00:15:21.240 Put a lot of work initially into. 00:15:21.240 --> 00:15:30.800 Yeah, so Linux, macOS, and Windows with good support for the new Windows terminal, very limited support for the old command prompt. 00:15:30.800 --> 00:15:31.860 That's still pretty good. 00:15:31.860 --> 00:15:32.620 That's still pretty good. 00:15:32.620 --> 00:15:34.080 I think it's fantastic, actually. 00:15:34.080 --> 00:15:39.340 If people are really passionate about their terminal and they're on Windows, they probably know about Windows terminal anyway. 00:15:39.340 --> 00:15:40.460 So they're probably good. 00:15:40.460 --> 00:15:40.660 That's true. 00:15:40.660 --> 00:15:41.300 Yeah. 00:15:41.300 --> 00:15:44.800 The one that I thought was interesting and nice is Jupyter Notebooks. 00:15:44.800 --> 00:15:46.260 What's the support there? 00:15:46.260 --> 00:15:49.180 So it works quite, quite well. 00:15:49.180 --> 00:15:52.760 So I wasn't a big Jupyter user at the time. 00:15:52.760 --> 00:15:55.400 I was obviously aware of it, but I didn't use it myself. 00:15:55.400 --> 00:15:58.360 And people asked me for Jupyter support. 00:15:58.360 --> 00:16:00.000 And I thought, it doesn't do that. 00:16:00.000 --> 00:16:00.820 It just works in the terminal. 00:16:00.820 --> 00:16:01.980 But then I looked into it. 00:16:01.980 --> 00:16:08.000 And it wasn't too bad because I already had functionality to export terminal content to HTML. 00:16:08.520 --> 00:16:14.580 So I could put a little wrapper around that, export it to HTML, and then insert it into Jupyter. 00:16:14.580 --> 00:16:18.320 They've got an API which allows you to write content into a notebook. 00:16:18.320 --> 00:16:22.540 And so I got Jupyter support up quite quickly, quite easily. 00:16:22.540 --> 00:16:25.720 And it works quite nicely, which people appreciate. 00:16:25.720 --> 00:16:29.780 It means that you can write code which writes to terminal mostly. 00:16:29.780 --> 00:16:34.180 But if you do happen to run it in a Jupyter notebook, then it'll write the same thing there as well. 00:16:34.180 --> 00:16:38.240 It just knows, it detects that it's running in the Jupyter environment. 00:16:38.240 --> 00:16:40.280 And then it just, all right, output is not print. 00:16:40.280 --> 00:16:41.780 Output is generate HTML. 00:16:41.780 --> 00:16:42.740 Exactly, yeah. 00:16:42.740 --> 00:16:45.040 And Jupyter does have support for that. 00:16:45.040 --> 00:16:49.200 It will capture standard output and it will convert the colors and everything. 00:16:49.820 --> 00:16:52.700 But the problem is it wrapped the lines. 00:16:52.700 --> 00:16:56.240 So if you expanded the window, it would break any kind of neat formatting. 00:16:56.240 --> 00:16:59.400 If you've got like a grid or a table, it would break that. 00:16:59.400 --> 00:17:03.720 So I had to do the HTML export within Rich as well. 00:17:03.720 --> 00:17:04.020 Yeah. 00:17:04.020 --> 00:17:11.200 Basically, most anywhere people do Python with a UI of some sort, this works is the takeaway. 00:17:11.200 --> 00:17:11.620 Yeah. 00:17:11.620 --> 00:17:18.760 This portion of Talk Python To Me is brought to you by Shortcut, formerly known as Clubhouse.io. 00:17:18.920 --> 00:17:20.640 Happy with your project management tool? 00:17:20.640 --> 00:17:24.920 Most tools are either too simple for a growing engineering team to manage everything, 00:17:24.920 --> 00:17:29.000 or way too complex for anyone to want to use them without constant prodding. 00:17:29.000 --> 00:17:31.940 Shortcut is different though, because it's worse. 00:17:31.940 --> 00:17:33.380 No, wait, no, I mean it's better. 00:17:33.380 --> 00:17:37.140 Shortcut is project management built specifically for software teams. 00:17:37.140 --> 00:17:41.900 It's fast, intuitive, flexible, powerful, and many other nice, positive adjectives. 00:17:41.900 --> 00:17:44.520 Key features include team-based workflows. 00:17:44.520 --> 00:17:48.900 Individual teams can use default workflows or customize them to match the 00:17:48.900 --> 00:17:49.560 the way they work. 00:17:49.560 --> 00:17:51.620 Org-wide goals and roadmaps. 00:17:51.620 --> 00:17:55.720 The work in these workflows is automatically tied into larger company goals. 00:17:55.720 --> 00:18:01.320 It takes one click to move from a roadmap to a team's work to individual updates and back. 00:18:01.320 --> 00:18:03.180 Tight version control integration. 00:18:03.180 --> 00:18:07.660 Whether you use GitHub, GitLab, or Bitbucket, Clubhouse ties directly into them, 00:18:07.660 --> 00:18:10.040 so you can update progress from the command line. 00:18:10.040 --> 00:18:11.800 Keyboard-friendly interface. 00:18:11.980 --> 00:18:16.820 The rest of Shortcut is just as friendly as their power bar, allowing you to do virtually 00:18:16.820 --> 00:18:18.740 anything without touching your mouse. 00:18:18.740 --> 00:18:20.000 Throw that thing in the trash. 00:18:20.000 --> 00:18:21.580 Iteration planning. 00:18:21.580 --> 00:18:26.580 Set weekly priorities and let Shortcut run the schedule for you with accompanying burndown 00:18:26.580 --> 00:18:27.740 charts and other reporting. 00:18:27.740 --> 00:18:32.580 Give it a try over at talkpython.fm/shortcut. 00:18:32.800 --> 00:18:36.140 Again, that's talkpython.fm/shortcut. 00:18:36.140 --> 00:18:40.740 Choose shortcut because you shouldn't have to project manage your project management. 00:18:42.740 --> 00:18:47.340 Just going back to the pip-pinning version stuff, Wayland on the livestream says pip-compile. 00:18:47.340 --> 00:18:52.680 Pip-tools is a game changer for pin dependencies and pip-compile specifically for managing pin 00:18:52.680 --> 00:18:53.560 dependencies. 00:18:53.560 --> 00:18:54.700 That's what I've switched to as well. 00:18:54.700 --> 00:18:59.040 So I just run a script, checks for all the new versions, regenerates all the pip-compiled 00:18:59.040 --> 00:18:59.640 stuff. 00:18:59.640 --> 00:19:01.180 And I'm really enjoying that. 00:19:01.180 --> 00:19:01.940 I think that's fantastic. 00:19:01.940 --> 00:19:02.260 Okay. 00:19:02.260 --> 00:19:03.260 I've not used pip-compile. 00:19:03.260 --> 00:19:03.980 I'll have to check that out. 00:19:03.980 --> 00:19:04.280 All right. 00:19:04.280 --> 00:19:11.440 You basically define a requirements file that has what you actually would have pip-typed, 00:19:11.440 --> 00:19:17.040 pip install, and then it will generate a requirements.txt that is the transitive closure of all of 00:19:17.040 --> 00:19:18.420 those dependencies, which are pinned. 00:19:18.420 --> 00:19:22.560 And then you can ask any time for it to update the versions, the pinned versions of that. 00:19:22.560 --> 00:19:22.900 Okay. 00:19:22.900 --> 00:19:25.880 Is that like Poetry's log files? 00:19:25.880 --> 00:19:27.100 I think it's similar. 00:19:27.100 --> 00:19:27.380 Yeah. 00:19:27.380 --> 00:19:29.220 I'm not 100% sure, but I think so. 00:19:29.220 --> 00:19:29.760 All right. 00:19:29.760 --> 00:19:32.700 So let's talk about various features here. 00:19:32.700 --> 00:19:36.360 I think just going through, I mean, we touched on them, but let's dive into it a little bit, 00:19:36.360 --> 00:19:38.160 maybe talk a little bit about the code you write. 00:19:38.160 --> 00:19:38.320 Sure. 00:19:38.520 --> 00:19:41.540 So Kim Van Wake is here to kick us off on the first one. 00:19:41.540 --> 00:19:46.120 Try something as simple as from rich import print in your next project, and you will be 00:19:46.120 --> 00:19:46.620 amazed. 00:19:46.620 --> 00:19:50.800 So Will, tell us why we'll be amazed. 00:19:50.800 --> 00:19:52.980 Like what's this alternate print? 00:19:52.980 --> 00:19:57.660 When I first wrote this as a console class, you have to construct a class and that's got 00:19:57.660 --> 00:19:58.680 a print method. 00:19:59.240 --> 00:20:04.900 But I figured I could just overwrite the existing, the built-in print because it's a, it's a function 00:20:04.900 --> 00:20:05.980 in Python three. 00:20:05.980 --> 00:20:07.820 I can just replace it with my own version. 00:20:07.820 --> 00:20:09.480 So that's what I've done here. 00:20:09.480 --> 00:20:13.440 I'll give, there's a version of print that you can import from rich, which has the same 00:20:13.440 --> 00:20:18.500 signature as a built-in print, but it supports the console markup. 00:20:18.620 --> 00:20:24.100 So you can insert these little square brackets with a style like, here we've got bold magenta 00:20:24.100 --> 00:20:28.280 and it'll do emojis, colon, vampire, colon. 00:20:28.280 --> 00:20:34.560 And these styles, like the square bracket, bold magenta slash bold magenta, this is specific 00:20:34.560 --> 00:20:35.140 to rich. 00:20:35.140 --> 00:20:37.180 This is something that you came up with. 00:20:37.260 --> 00:20:38.080 Yeah, that's right. 00:20:38.080 --> 00:20:42.560 It's called, I call it console markup and the syntax is very BB code like. 00:20:42.560 --> 00:20:44.680 I don't know if you ever used BB code. 00:20:44.680 --> 00:20:45.400 Yeah. 00:20:45.400 --> 00:20:46.240 It's quite simple. 00:20:46.240 --> 00:20:50.560 It's just like a markup where the tags have square brackets. 00:20:50.560 --> 00:20:51.020 Yeah. 00:20:51.020 --> 00:20:56.160 I like this a lot because one of the things that I'll use a lot still is, which maybe I 00:20:56.160 --> 00:20:58.960 need to start switching to what you're doing here, is Colorama. 00:20:58.960 --> 00:21:06.360 But for Colorama, you'll do things like you'll import the foreground settings or styles and then 00:21:06.360 --> 00:21:10.840 you can say foreground dot green plus the text. 00:21:10.840 --> 00:21:11.400 Yeah. 00:21:11.400 --> 00:21:15.320 Foreground reset to go back to normal, but you don't have the bold. 00:21:15.320 --> 00:21:18.260 And then all of that stuff has to happen in code, right? 00:21:18.260 --> 00:21:22.700 If I wanted to say import some text and then show it on the screen, that text could have 00:21:22.700 --> 00:21:24.360 these styles in it, right? 00:21:24.360 --> 00:21:24.800 That's right. 00:21:24.800 --> 00:21:25.020 Yeah. 00:21:25.020 --> 00:21:29.520 So you can embed it in code easier or read it from a file, et cetera. 00:21:29.520 --> 00:21:33.800 I think it's a bit easier to read rather than doing lots of string concatenations. 00:21:34.180 --> 00:21:36.640 And also the benefit over the Colorama approach. 00:21:36.640 --> 00:21:38.500 Colorama is a very good bit of software. 00:21:38.500 --> 00:21:40.080 I've relied on it for years. 00:21:40.080 --> 00:21:45.240 But the problem is when you concatenate strings like that, you insert these ANSI codes. 00:21:45.240 --> 00:21:47.880 Once you've built that string, you can't do anything with it really. 00:21:47.880 --> 00:21:49.340 You can't word wrap it. 00:21:49.340 --> 00:21:50.820 You can't format it. 00:21:50.820 --> 00:21:52.960 So with console markup, you can do. 00:21:52.960 --> 00:21:55.960 You can markup bits of text with color and style, et cetera. 00:21:55.960 --> 00:22:02.260 And then you can further do operations on them like word wrap and centering text and putting 00:22:02.260 --> 00:22:03.260 it inside the table, et cetera. 00:22:03.260 --> 00:22:03.600 Right. 00:22:03.600 --> 00:22:07.920 Two other things that jump out here that are interesting is you have emoji support. 00:22:07.920 --> 00:22:12.220 So you can say colon vampire colon, which is pretty awesome. 00:22:12.860 --> 00:22:19.080 You can technically, if the file format supports it, you could actually put a vampire emoji 00:22:19.080 --> 00:22:19.960 in the string. 00:22:19.960 --> 00:22:20.540 Yeah. 00:22:20.540 --> 00:22:23.740 But it's still kind of nice that you have this sort of emoji lookup, right? 00:22:23.740 --> 00:22:24.140 Exactly. 00:22:24.140 --> 00:22:28.900 Because if you want to insert the Unicode character, you'd have to go and find it and then cut and 00:22:28.900 --> 00:22:29.360 paste it. 00:22:29.360 --> 00:22:29.680 Yeah. 00:22:29.720 --> 00:22:30.920 You can just do colon. 00:22:30.920 --> 00:22:36.260 You can set that into console markup, just colon vampire colon or colon smiley colon. 00:22:36.260 --> 00:22:38.960 I think there's a couple of thousand emojis you can use there now. 00:22:38.960 --> 00:22:39.400 Fantastic. 00:22:39.400 --> 00:22:45.380 Then another thing that jumps out is you're printing hello, bold magenta world. 00:22:45.380 --> 00:22:48.300 So that's the word world, bold and magenta. 00:22:48.300 --> 00:22:49.460 And then the vampire. 00:22:49.460 --> 00:22:51.820 But then you're also printing out a dictionary. 00:22:51.820 --> 00:22:57.620 And the dictionary is like pretty printed, but also syntax highlighted. 00:22:57.620 --> 00:23:04.000 So if you print a container, like a dictionary, a list, or like an atomic Python type, it'll 00:23:04.000 --> 00:23:05.760 run the pretty printer over it. 00:23:05.760 --> 00:23:09.280 So it will format it in kind of the style that people like. 00:23:09.280 --> 00:23:11.560 In code, you'd probably format. 00:23:11.560 --> 00:23:13.520 This is how black would format it. 00:23:13.520 --> 00:23:15.020 So it looks much the same. 00:23:15.020 --> 00:23:18.620 Then it runs the syntax highlighting over it. 00:23:18.620 --> 00:23:19.860 There's a few regular expressions. 00:23:19.860 --> 00:23:25.620 So in which you can say anything between two quotes is a string and therefore it's green. 00:23:25.620 --> 00:23:29.220 Anything in angle of brackets is a tag-like thing. 00:23:29.220 --> 00:23:35.260 So I'll bold the brackets and change the tag name to bright red or whatever it is. 00:23:35.260 --> 00:23:41.920 And so that the output you get is quite readable and looks like something that came out of VS Code or your editor. 00:23:42.680 --> 00:23:43.120 Yeah. 00:23:43.120 --> 00:23:49.380 The more I look at this, the more I think maybe just every project, I'm going to follow Kim's advice and just from rich import print. 00:23:49.380 --> 00:23:50.840 Because why not? 00:23:50.840 --> 00:23:53.500 This looks, it has all this cool auto formatting. 00:23:53.500 --> 00:23:58.320 Does it look actually at the type that it's printing to make any determination? 00:23:58.320 --> 00:24:01.720 Or does it just look and see if it's source code and then try to format it? 00:24:01.720 --> 00:24:03.200 It looks at the type. 00:24:03.400 --> 00:24:07.440 Like if it gets a dictionary or it gets an object versus getting it like a true string. 00:24:07.440 --> 00:24:08.120 It'll do both. 00:24:08.120 --> 00:24:10.120 It'll syntax highlight a string. 00:24:10.120 --> 00:24:15.640 But if it's a container, if it knows that the type, it'll do some syntax highlighting there. 00:24:15.640 --> 00:24:23.080 There's also a simple protocol you can add to your own objects if you want them pretty printed and formatted. 00:24:23.280 --> 00:24:23.700 Oh, okay. 00:24:23.700 --> 00:24:27.860 But not dunder stir, dunder repper, but something else. 00:24:27.860 --> 00:24:28.700 Dunder rich. 00:24:28.700 --> 00:24:30.500 It is dunder rich repper. 00:24:30.500 --> 00:24:30.980 Right. 00:24:30.980 --> 00:24:36.180 You can specify the arguments and parameters and the indentation. 00:24:36.180 --> 00:24:39.940 It'll render something that's very much like a pretty printed dict. 00:24:39.940 --> 00:24:44.640 That sounds like something that would be fantastic to add to some intermediate library that people use. 00:24:44.640 --> 00:24:47.380 So I, sure, I could create a class and add it to mine. 00:24:47.380 --> 00:24:53.400 But so often what I want to do is print out a MongoEngine model or a SQLAlchemy model or a Pydantic model. 00:24:53.400 --> 00:24:53.700 Yeah. 00:24:53.700 --> 00:24:54.780 Pydantic could add that. 00:24:54.780 --> 00:24:55.560 Or, you know what I mean? 00:24:55.560 --> 00:24:58.460 Like these like intermediate SQLAlchemy could add something like that. 00:24:58.460 --> 00:25:00.420 Oh, this is how you describe. 00:25:00.420 --> 00:25:02.300 Like this one has an index and whatnot. 00:25:02.300 --> 00:25:03.320 I think that'd be fantastic. 00:25:03.320 --> 00:25:03.560 Yeah. 00:25:03.560 --> 00:25:05.540 So I've added to Attrs. 00:25:05.540 --> 00:25:08.580 So it'll pretty print objects from the Attrs library. 00:25:08.580 --> 00:25:11.800 I have a PR for Pydantic as well. 00:25:11.800 --> 00:25:18.240 So hopefully in the future, you print a Pydantic object and it will format it quite similar to the built-in data structures. 00:25:18.240 --> 00:25:18.540 Yeah. 00:25:18.540 --> 00:25:19.180 Okay. 00:25:19.180 --> 00:25:19.780 Fantastic. 00:25:19.780 --> 00:25:20.340 I love it. 00:25:20.340 --> 00:25:25.000 Before we move on to this, I do want to talk about some other things because we're just scratching the surface here. 00:25:25.000 --> 00:25:31.720 But one of the things that I think has both impressed me and, you know, Brian and I over on Python Bytes on our podcast we do there, 00:25:31.720 --> 00:25:39.800 we've been continuously impressed at how fast you're adding new features and still kind of keeping the ethos of this library together. 00:25:40.040 --> 00:25:44.060 So how, maybe give people a little hint on just the velocity here. 00:25:44.060 --> 00:25:44.880 Like how's that work? 00:25:44.880 --> 00:25:47.600 Well, I'm not convinced that it's been that fast. 00:25:47.600 --> 00:25:49.080 I mean, bear in mind Rich is... 00:25:49.080 --> 00:25:50.140 It felt like a lot of work. 00:25:50.140 --> 00:25:51.040 It didn't feel that fast. 00:25:51.040 --> 00:25:55.880 When I add new stuff to Rich, I'm not starting from scratch. 00:25:55.880 --> 00:26:00.260 There's several layers which are already built and well tested. 00:26:00.260 --> 00:26:04.540 The bit that I add might not be as large as it, maybe it looks. 00:26:04.540 --> 00:26:05.040 I see. 00:26:05.040 --> 00:26:09.940 So you've already got a lot of structure and architecture that makes adding a new feature... 00:26:09.940 --> 00:26:10.340 Yeah. 00:26:10.340 --> 00:26:11.640 ...from scratch sort of thing, right? 00:26:11.640 --> 00:26:12.780 So a good design basically. 00:26:12.780 --> 00:26:13.480 I hope so, yeah. 00:26:13.480 --> 00:26:20.760 And it seems to be working quite well because, you know, I did build a core feature set and then I added some things to it. 00:26:20.760 --> 00:26:24.920 And admittedly, those things came quite fast because it wasn't that hard to implement. 00:26:24.920 --> 00:26:28.880 And I've got to a point now where Rich is quite large. 00:26:29.140 --> 00:26:36.400 I'd be resistant to adding any more stuff to it unless it is very useful for like a broad selection of users. 00:26:36.400 --> 00:26:36.820 Sure. 00:26:36.820 --> 00:26:38.960 Do you have a sense of how many lines of code it is? 00:26:38.960 --> 00:26:40.420 I know you don't mean large in that sense. 00:26:40.420 --> 00:26:41.660 You mean large in sort of feature set. 00:26:41.660 --> 00:26:43.360 But do you have a sense of how many lines of code? 00:26:43.360 --> 00:26:43.980 You know what? 00:26:43.980 --> 00:26:44.600 I've never checked. 00:26:44.600 --> 00:26:46.780 I couldn't guess. 00:26:46.780 --> 00:26:52.660 By the time we're done with this recording, someone out in the audience will have like already downloaded and checked for us. 00:26:52.660 --> 00:26:53.000 Who knows? 00:26:53.000 --> 00:26:53.760 Probably. 00:26:53.760 --> 00:26:53.920 All right. 00:26:53.920 --> 00:26:56.340 So the next thing let's talk about is the REPL. 00:26:56.340 --> 00:27:02.880 So I can create a REPL redevelop print loop by typing the word Python on the terminal. 00:27:02.880 --> 00:27:04.160 And that opens it up. 00:27:04.160 --> 00:27:05.740 But it looks just... 00:27:05.740 --> 00:27:09.860 It's probably the least possibly good experiences you can have in Python, right? 00:27:09.900 --> 00:27:11.100 There's no color. 00:27:11.100 --> 00:27:14.800 There's no feedback on sort of what's happening, right? 00:27:14.800 --> 00:27:18.940 But then I can say from rich import pretty, pretty.install. 00:27:18.940 --> 00:27:26.760 And then all of a sudden, basically the output of the REPL, like if I'd set a variable name, it'll print it out. 00:27:26.760 --> 00:27:28.960 Like that becomes rich printed, right? 00:27:28.960 --> 00:27:30.020 That's right. 00:27:30.020 --> 00:27:30.220 Yeah. 00:27:30.220 --> 00:27:30.820 Yeah. 00:27:30.820 --> 00:27:33.620 So yeah, you call pretty.install. 00:27:33.620 --> 00:27:36.380 And then everything you put into the... 00:27:36.380 --> 00:27:38.360 After the prompt will be pretty printed. 00:27:38.740 --> 00:27:45.580 So previously, if you print a dict without rich, it'll just smash it onto a few lines. 00:27:45.580 --> 00:27:47.880 It's quite hard to visually parse. 00:27:47.880 --> 00:27:51.640 It's all one line except for the word wrapping, which doesn't even break on words. 00:27:51.640 --> 00:27:53.720 And there's zero color, right? 00:27:53.720 --> 00:27:54.380 Yeah. 00:27:54.380 --> 00:27:55.160 Exactly. 00:27:55.160 --> 00:27:57.160 So it's quite difficult to read. 00:27:57.160 --> 00:28:00.700 I'm quite a visual person, so I always had difficulty with this. 00:28:00.700 --> 00:28:05.260 If it was more than two lines, it'd be quite difficult for me to figure out where the keys and the values are. 00:28:05.260 --> 00:28:12.420 But if you do it with rich, it'll pretty print it onto lines and it'll indent it like you would code and then it'll highlight it. 00:28:12.480 --> 00:28:14.460 So it makes things just much more readable. 00:28:14.460 --> 00:28:14.960 Yeah. 00:28:14.960 --> 00:28:18.940 A lot of people will put it in their startup file, so they just get this ripple by default. 00:28:18.940 --> 00:28:19.620 Oh, interesting. 00:28:19.620 --> 00:28:20.780 Yeah, that's a good idea. 00:28:20.780 --> 00:28:31.000 Have you tried this on the more advanced repls like PT Python or BT Python or those where you kind of get an Emacs E or Vim experience? 00:28:31.160 --> 00:28:31.600 I haven't. 00:28:31.600 --> 00:28:37.280 No, I've tried it on IPython and it works quite nicely on IPython, but I haven't tried it on other repls. 00:28:37.280 --> 00:28:40.340 Yeah, it probably works on PT Python, but I haven't tried it. 00:28:40.340 --> 00:28:40.900 Cool. 00:28:40.900 --> 00:28:41.640 All right. 00:28:41.640 --> 00:28:47.640 Now, another thing that you can do a lot with is sort of taking it up to the next level is the console. 00:28:47.640 --> 00:28:48.460 Tell us about this. 00:28:48.460 --> 00:28:53.760 Yeah, so the console class gives you more kind of advanced features. 00:28:53.760 --> 00:28:55.920 There's more options, more things to specify. 00:28:56.580 --> 00:28:59.460 Typically, you'd have a single console per project. 00:28:59.460 --> 00:29:03.540 You'd keep it in your top level object or as a global. 00:29:03.540 --> 00:29:12.900 It has a print method and there's also some other methods like there's a log method and there's a whole bunch of features you can do when you construct the console. 00:29:12.900 --> 00:29:16.040 Things like exporting the output to HTML. 00:29:16.040 --> 00:29:16.480 Okay. 00:29:16.480 --> 00:29:17.420 Nice. 00:29:17.420 --> 00:29:18.360 That's fantastic. 00:29:18.360 --> 00:29:18.620 Yeah. 00:29:18.620 --> 00:29:25.420 So one of the things you can do with the console, for example, is you can set a style on console.print and set some styles. 00:29:25.800 --> 00:29:31.780 And then it'll come out in that style as opposed to embedding this console markup into the text itself, right? 00:29:31.780 --> 00:29:32.160 Yeah. 00:29:32.160 --> 00:29:39.160 So sometimes you might not want the console markup, especially if there's going to be square brackets in the output. 00:29:39.160 --> 00:29:40.980 You don't want them to be confused with. 00:29:40.980 --> 00:29:41.240 Right. 00:29:41.240 --> 00:29:51.200 Or even if you're receiving a string and you just need to put it on the screen, but you haven't generated the string or it was generated by some other part of the app. 00:29:51.200 --> 00:29:53.340 Like here's a message I need to log this that I got. 00:29:53.340 --> 00:29:53.740 Exactly. 00:29:53.740 --> 00:29:57.260 You don't want to parse the string to try to put text into it or more text, right? 00:29:57.260 --> 00:29:57.580 Yeah. 00:29:57.580 --> 00:29:58.240 Exactly. 00:29:58.240 --> 00:30:05.700 So you can disable the highlighting and you can still set a style globally for that string if you want it in red or cyan, whatever. 00:30:05.700 --> 00:30:09.440 You can still get that, but you can disable the console markup. 00:30:09.580 --> 00:30:09.780 Nice. 00:30:09.780 --> 00:30:13.440 And then we have the inspect, rich inspect. 00:30:13.440 --> 00:30:14.740 What is this one? 00:30:14.740 --> 00:30:19.980 This is my favorite function in rich and it came quite late. 00:30:19.980 --> 00:30:30.400 But what it does is you call it with any object and it'll inspect the object and it'll pull out doc strings and it'll pull out methods. 00:30:30.400 --> 00:30:35.420 And then it'll render it in quite a nice little table that's quite easy to read. 00:30:35.420 --> 00:30:39.680 And I find this terrific for exploring APIs. 00:30:39.680 --> 00:30:42.220 Sometimes it's better than documentation. 00:30:42.220 --> 00:30:46.760 You know, if you get an object back from an API, you don't quite know what methods it supports. 00:30:46.760 --> 00:30:48.680 You just call rich.inspect. 00:30:48.680 --> 00:30:53.460 I could have typed something like dir, my, you know, print dir, my object. 00:30:53.460 --> 00:31:01.220 And I get a list of dictionary objects which are representing, you know, fields and methods and whatnot. 00:31:01.220 --> 00:31:01.860 Exactly. 00:31:01.860 --> 00:31:02.620 But they're all jammed together. 00:31:02.620 --> 00:31:04.140 There's no like help. 00:31:04.140 --> 00:31:05.260 This is fantastic. 00:31:05.260 --> 00:31:11.380 So it's like almost a table version of that with one line of help next to it, right? 00:31:11.380 --> 00:31:11.640 Yeah. 00:31:11.640 --> 00:31:14.660 So it does the same kind of thing as dir or help. 00:31:14.660 --> 00:31:16.060 But way, way nicer, yeah. 00:31:16.060 --> 00:31:17.720 It makes it easier, easier to read. 00:31:17.720 --> 00:31:18.740 There's also two things. 00:31:18.740 --> 00:31:24.500 I see there's a block of stuff that has, it's like a list of, I guess those are field names. 00:31:24.500 --> 00:31:26.080 And then it has the methods. 00:31:26.080 --> 00:31:28.300 It's sort of called out separately as well. 00:31:28.300 --> 00:31:31.320 So you're like, these are the fields or properties or these are the fields. 00:31:31.320 --> 00:31:33.540 And then here's the probably methods and properties, right? 00:31:33.540 --> 00:31:33.920 That's right. 00:31:33.920 --> 00:31:34.120 Yeah. 00:31:34.120 --> 00:31:40.140 So it basically shows you the signature of all the methods and the first line of the doc string. 00:31:40.140 --> 00:31:42.620 There's an option to show you the full details. 00:31:42.620 --> 00:31:47.620 But I find just that abbreviated information is generally as much as I need. 00:31:47.780 --> 00:31:48.480 Oh, this is fantastic. 00:31:48.740 --> 00:31:52.700 So it says things like copy equals def, copy, bracket, bracket. 00:31:52.700 --> 00:31:55.420 Would it say async def if it was an async method? 00:31:55.420 --> 00:31:58.760 Or what's the alternative of def there? 00:31:58.760 --> 00:31:59.980 Is it just to show it's a method? 00:31:59.980 --> 00:32:01.160 That's just to show it's a method. 00:32:01.160 --> 00:32:02.420 That's a good point about async. 00:32:02.420 --> 00:32:04.660 I don't think it does do async def. 00:32:04.660 --> 00:32:05.840 And that's a good idea. 00:32:06.020 --> 00:32:11.060 It'd be pretty dope to throw in an async def or maybe a property if it's a getter method, right? 00:32:11.060 --> 00:32:11.780 You're right. 00:32:11.780 --> 00:32:12.060 Yeah. 00:32:12.060 --> 00:32:13.380 I think they probably should do that. 00:32:13.380 --> 00:32:17.800 They should inspect the method and see whether it's async and then emphasize that. 00:32:17.800 --> 00:32:18.020 Yeah. 00:32:18.020 --> 00:32:18.640 It's a good idea. 00:32:18.640 --> 00:32:19.660 Yeah, sure. 00:32:19.660 --> 00:32:21.940 We'll open a PR on that podcast here. 00:32:21.940 --> 00:32:22.320 No problem. 00:32:22.320 --> 00:32:23.440 All right. 00:32:23.440 --> 00:32:28.360 So those are ones that you've got like graphics calling them out as some of the really main 00:32:28.360 --> 00:32:28.840 things. 00:32:28.840 --> 00:32:30.100 There's so much happening here. 00:32:30.100 --> 00:32:31.020 That's that's amazing. 00:32:31.020 --> 00:32:36.160 But like Waylon out in the live stream points out like mention rich tracebacks. 00:32:36.160 --> 00:32:37.460 They're so good. 00:32:37.460 --> 00:32:40.060 I have my ipython automatically start up with that. 00:32:40.060 --> 00:32:45.220 And yeah, you've got a whole section down here under the library of things like logging, 00:32:45.220 --> 00:32:50.180 log handlers, progress bars, status, tree views, like crazy. 00:32:50.180 --> 00:32:54.100 You have tree views in the terminal that can expand and collapse with the mouse. 00:32:54.100 --> 00:32:57.400 You know, there's there's more going on here than just the stuff we've touched on. 00:32:57.400 --> 00:32:57.560 Right. 00:32:57.560 --> 00:32:58.700 There's a bunch of cool features. 00:32:58.700 --> 00:32:59.780 There's a lot going on. 00:32:59.780 --> 00:33:00.000 Yeah. 00:33:00.000 --> 00:33:02.480 Well, Rich will render the tree view. 00:33:02.480 --> 00:33:06.840 It's textual, which provides the collapsing and navigation features. 00:33:06.840 --> 00:33:07.100 Yeah. 00:33:07.100 --> 00:33:07.980 Ah, got it. 00:33:07.980 --> 00:33:08.220 Got it. 00:33:08.220 --> 00:33:08.480 Got it. 00:33:08.480 --> 00:33:08.620 Okay. 00:33:08.840 --> 00:33:10.720 So we'll get to the interactive bits. 00:33:10.720 --> 00:33:14.720 But yeah, so I can still draw a tree view even with like little your example here. 00:33:14.720 --> 00:33:17.680 You've got emoji icons for say folders and files. 00:33:17.680 --> 00:33:22.560 And then even in the file, you've got an embedded syntax highlighted bit of code that comes out 00:33:22.560 --> 00:33:27.200 of one of the files and a markdown with some of the markdown rendered as a rich markdown. 00:33:27.200 --> 00:33:27.520 Yeah. 00:33:27.520 --> 00:33:28.380 Just a markdown. 00:33:28.380 --> 00:33:31.740 Like not, not rich the library, but like just colorized and formatted. 00:33:31.740 --> 00:33:32.060 Yeah. 00:33:32.060 --> 00:33:36.080 So it goes back to the composability of rich, rich objects. 00:33:36.080 --> 00:33:40.060 I call them renderables, but you can use them in various contexts. 00:33:40.060 --> 00:33:43.740 So in here, you can set a renderable per node on the tree. 00:33:43.740 --> 00:33:50.400 So you can like do what we've done here, add a table next to a tree item or some syntax highlighting 00:33:50.400 --> 00:33:51.900 or render some markdown. 00:33:51.900 --> 00:33:55.800 It doesn't really matter to rich what you ask it to render. 00:33:55.800 --> 00:33:57.900 You can just do it in various contexts. 00:33:58.060 --> 00:33:58.280 Yeah. 00:33:58.280 --> 00:33:58.800 Very cool. 00:33:58.800 --> 00:33:59.020 Okay. 00:33:59.020 --> 00:34:00.720 So we've got the tree, which is amazing. 00:34:00.720 --> 00:34:03.880 Let's, you know, since Waylon mentioned it, let's talk tracebacks real quick. 00:34:03.880 --> 00:34:10.080 I mean, one of the things that really is tricky with the tracebacks is, you know, a lot of 00:34:10.080 --> 00:34:13.820 times you've got to go to like one end of them to see sort of the error. 00:34:13.820 --> 00:34:15.580 And then like, there's no color. 00:34:15.580 --> 00:34:17.880 There's just a lot of stuff dropping in there. 00:34:18.580 --> 00:34:22.940 Maybe sometimes it'll show the variable values, but they're not really got to kind of pull 00:34:22.940 --> 00:34:23.440 them out. 00:34:23.440 --> 00:34:23.760 Right. 00:34:23.760 --> 00:34:24.400 Things like that. 00:34:24.400 --> 00:34:27.460 And what you get here is, is ridiculous. 00:34:27.460 --> 00:34:30.260 First of all, what do I do to make this happen with the beautiful tracebacks? 00:34:30.260 --> 00:34:34.280 You can do from rich import traceback, traceback.install. 00:34:34.280 --> 00:34:34.820 Oh, good. 00:34:34.820 --> 00:34:35.140 Yeah. 00:34:35.140 --> 00:34:39.240 From then on, if you don't, if you don't handle an exception, it'll be printed with rich 00:34:39.240 --> 00:34:40.740 or you can explicitly. 00:34:40.740 --> 00:34:41.180 All right. 00:34:41.180 --> 00:34:42.200 There's the second thing I got. 00:34:42.200 --> 00:34:43.280 I just put on all my apps. 00:34:43.780 --> 00:34:44.040 Yeah. 00:34:44.040 --> 00:34:46.120 It's a piece of cake to add. 00:34:46.120 --> 00:34:47.560 So yeah, it's easy to do. 00:34:47.560 --> 00:34:47.780 Yeah. 00:34:47.780 --> 00:34:51.900 So tell me what people who are not seeing this necessarily on the screen, like what is this 00:34:51.900 --> 00:34:54.140 alternative traceback style look like here? 00:34:54.140 --> 00:34:54.460 Okay. 00:34:54.460 --> 00:34:59.220 So it actually follows much the same format as a regular Python traceback. 00:34:59.220 --> 00:35:05.560 It's just underneath the file, you'll see some syntax highlighted code showing you that 00:35:05.560 --> 00:35:11.640 the line where the exception happened for each frame and underneath each block of code, 00:35:11.700 --> 00:35:14.840 it'll show you the locals at that point in the frame. 00:35:14.840 --> 00:35:16.180 So you can see the local variables. 00:35:16.180 --> 00:35:16.540 Right. 00:35:16.540 --> 00:35:20.580 And these are called out in a nice table with a nice formatting that we've already talked 00:35:20.580 --> 00:35:20.760 about. 00:35:20.760 --> 00:35:25.260 So kind of as if you had done print, you know, from rich import print and then printed out 00:35:25.260 --> 00:35:26.500 the locals into a table. 00:35:26.500 --> 00:35:26.900 Yeah. 00:35:26.900 --> 00:35:28.340 And it's all, it's all pretty printed. 00:35:28.340 --> 00:35:29.680 So it's quite easy to read. 00:35:29.680 --> 00:35:35.780 I find with regular Python tracebacks is it, it takes quite a bit of skill to read them. 00:35:35.780 --> 00:35:36.080 Yeah. 00:35:36.080 --> 00:35:38.840 Particularly for beginners and even for intermediates. 00:35:38.980 --> 00:35:44.000 You've got to sit down and analyze the tracebacks, but I'm hoping, but this, this just kind of 00:35:44.000 --> 00:35:48.860 presents the information in a more readable way and you can like get more of the context 00:35:48.860 --> 00:35:49.280 of the error. 00:35:49.280 --> 00:35:49.620 Yeah. 00:35:49.620 --> 00:35:50.920 I think this is fantastic. 00:35:50.920 --> 00:35:52.560 This definitely super interesting. 00:35:52.700 --> 00:35:57.540 I guess one more thing here to really dive into, maybe two, two. 00:35:57.540 --> 00:35:59.720 I think the log handler is really nice. 00:35:59.720 --> 00:36:01.680 People should check that out, but maybe tables. 00:36:01.680 --> 00:36:06.540 I know it's, it doesn't sound as appealing and amazing as necessarily as what we've been 00:36:06.540 --> 00:36:07.020 talking about. 00:36:07.020 --> 00:36:13.240 But if I want to have a nice formatted table in a text output, I basically just don't do 00:36:13.240 --> 00:36:13.380 that. 00:36:13.380 --> 00:36:15.440 I'm like, that is way too much work. 00:36:15.440 --> 00:36:15.940 Yeah. 00:36:15.940 --> 00:36:16.480 Yeah. 00:36:16.540 --> 00:36:17.540 to worry about this. 00:36:17.540 --> 00:36:18.120 Right. 00:36:18.120 --> 00:36:25.900 But with using rich here, you can have almost HTML level formatting styles, you know, borders 00:36:25.900 --> 00:36:29.820 on border off, just header content divider, like alternating rows. 00:36:29.820 --> 00:36:31.800 Like I said, a right align, left align. 00:36:31.800 --> 00:36:33.800 There's all sorts of amazing stuff here. 00:36:33.800 --> 00:36:34.680 Tell us about the tables. 00:36:34.680 --> 00:36:38.640 I didn't realize how hard tables would be to implement when I started it or I might 00:36:38.640 --> 00:36:39.040 not have. 00:36:39.040 --> 00:36:41.240 You might not have done it, huh? 00:36:41.240 --> 00:36:47.620 Tables are quite complicated because you've got to calculate optimal column widths and that 00:36:47.620 --> 00:36:53.460 gets really complicated when you've got text, which can, can wrap and other like renderables 00:36:53.460 --> 00:36:54.620 that can go in those cells. 00:36:54.620 --> 00:37:00.740 It does work quite nicely now and it can handle just about anything you can throw at it and 00:37:00.740 --> 00:37:06.340 it will scale the table nicely and elegantly if, if it doesn't fit into the, you know, 00:37:06.340 --> 00:37:07.060 the width of the terminal. 00:37:07.060 --> 00:37:09.880 And it's also quite a good layout tool. 00:37:09.880 --> 00:37:15.100 You can switch the borders off entirely and then use it to lay out other things. 00:37:15.100 --> 00:37:19.320 You know, one thing that comes to mind right away is I think of some of the nice progress 00:37:19.320 --> 00:37:22.400 bar type things for the terminal, like TQDM and stuff. 00:37:22.400 --> 00:37:26.460 And they're great, but I'm always like the stuff on the right, it'll have like what it's 00:37:26.460 --> 00:37:30.520 doing and then it'll have a progress bar and then it'll have maybe, you know, how fast 00:37:30.520 --> 00:37:32.740 is it operating or how much time has it got to go or something. 00:37:32.740 --> 00:37:35.840 And those are always kind of like doing like a little pulsing, like, cause the thing on 00:37:35.840 --> 00:37:38.600 the right is always changing and they don't never quite line up. 00:37:38.600 --> 00:37:42.480 You could just, you could do that here, but have a table and put the progress bar and one 00:37:42.480 --> 00:37:44.180 of the center fill bits, right? 00:37:44.180 --> 00:37:44.480 Yeah. 00:37:44.480 --> 00:37:48.860 So you can do lots of things regarding alignment to fit everything together. 00:37:48.860 --> 00:37:53.180 And like you said, stop that effect where bits of content will flicker because they're 00:37:53.180 --> 00:37:56.140 using less characters because it goes from a hundred and into 99 and then. 00:37:56.140 --> 00:37:56.540 Yeah, exactly. 00:37:56.540 --> 00:37:57.140 Yeah. 00:37:57.140 --> 00:37:57.600 Yeah. 00:37:57.600 --> 00:38:02.560 It's a very good layout tool and also just a good way of presenting tabular information, 00:38:02.560 --> 00:38:04.000 which is kind of what it was designed for. 00:38:04.000 --> 00:38:04.260 Yeah. 00:38:04.260 --> 00:38:05.700 It is a table, right? 00:38:05.700 --> 00:38:07.500 All right. 00:38:07.500 --> 00:38:14.420 So last one, I've got some content and probably a most common way that it's in a lightweight 00:38:14.420 --> 00:38:19.300 format, but you want to turn it into something full featured in terms of text is Markdown, 00:38:19.300 --> 00:38:19.700 right? 00:38:19.740 --> 00:38:23.920 So for example, the Python bytes website is almost like entire, like the vast majority 00:38:23.920 --> 00:38:27.820 of the content there is Markdown, talk by on training, like all the stuff we've got, the 00:38:27.820 --> 00:38:29.820 CMS we built in the back end, it's all Markdown. 00:38:29.820 --> 00:38:31.420 Rich has Markdown support too, right? 00:38:31.420 --> 00:38:31.820 That's right. 00:38:31.820 --> 00:38:31.980 Yeah. 00:38:31.980 --> 00:38:33.120 There's a Markdown class. 00:38:33.120 --> 00:38:37.200 And basically I took common Mark library, which parses the Markdown. 00:38:37.480 --> 00:38:37.720 Okay. 00:38:37.720 --> 00:38:43.260 I substituted the bits which were generating HTML with something which generates rich output. 00:38:43.260 --> 00:38:49.380 And it turns out there's a reasonable job of things like headers and does the style just 00:38:49.380 --> 00:38:49.800 fine. 00:38:49.800 --> 00:38:51.540 And there's also syntax highlighting. 00:38:51.540 --> 00:38:54.740 It'll actually call out to the syntax highlighting code. 00:38:54.740 --> 00:38:59.840 So if you've got a Python code block, it'll actually highlight that Python code block. 00:39:00.100 --> 00:39:00.140 Yeah. 00:39:00.140 --> 00:39:03.580 You have support for inline code with the backtick thing, backtick. 00:39:03.580 --> 00:39:03.860 Yeah. 00:39:03.860 --> 00:39:09.900 And the blocks of code, which are the triple backslashes or triple backticks or four spaces 00:39:09.900 --> 00:39:10.320 or whatever. 00:39:10.320 --> 00:39:10.660 Yeah. 00:39:10.660 --> 00:39:16.700 So it supports much of the basic common Mark syntax and does a reasonable job of rendering. 00:39:16.700 --> 00:39:20.820 It won't look quite as good as a web browser, but I find it quite readable. 00:39:20.820 --> 00:39:24.420 But it's in the terminal and I didn't have to do anything to get it there, right? 00:39:24.420 --> 00:39:26.620 So that's pretty fantastic. 00:39:26.620 --> 00:39:27.140 Yeah. 00:39:27.140 --> 00:39:28.280 Really, really nice. 00:39:28.280 --> 00:39:29.040 All right. 00:39:29.200 --> 00:39:35.620 So I think this is probably as much of the details of rich we want to dive into in terms 00:39:35.620 --> 00:39:38.780 of like the feature set and stuff, but there's still more to go. 00:39:38.780 --> 00:39:41.660 There's a lot to love out of this library, which is great. 00:39:41.660 --> 00:39:44.500 Maybe just give us a sense of the internals. 00:39:44.500 --> 00:39:45.900 Like, how did you make this happen? 00:39:45.900 --> 00:39:46.680 How do you make it work? 00:39:46.680 --> 00:39:50.400 Is this curses to the nth degree or what's happening? 00:39:50.400 --> 00:39:51.260 There's no curses. 00:39:51.260 --> 00:39:57.540 There's a layer, which what makes most of it work, where I render everything into, and that's 00:39:57.540 --> 00:39:59.620 a list of what I call segments. 00:39:59.620 --> 00:40:02.540 The segment consists of a bit of text plus a style. 00:40:02.540 --> 00:40:06.080 And the thing about having that intermediate layer before you actually render it to the 00:40:06.080 --> 00:40:09.860 terminal is you can manipulate it afterwards. 00:40:10.400 --> 00:40:17.460 So I can apply color and style and then do word wrapping and then I can render it onto the terminal. 00:40:17.460 --> 00:40:22.320 So everything is built on that and a protocol. 00:40:22.320 --> 00:40:24.540 So objects can add a couple of methods. 00:40:24.540 --> 00:40:28.380 They can add a Dunder rich or a Dunder rich console method. 00:40:28.380 --> 00:40:31.260 Then they can themselves be renderable. 00:40:31.340 --> 00:40:35.540 So you can print your own custom objects and that will use that intermediate layer of segments 00:40:35.540 --> 00:40:38.000 to render everything onto the terminal. 00:40:38.000 --> 00:40:38.460 Nice. 00:40:38.460 --> 00:40:38.840 Okay. 00:40:38.840 --> 00:40:39.380 Yeah. 00:40:39.380 --> 00:40:40.700 It sounds like a really good separation. 00:40:40.700 --> 00:40:44.820 And you could probably also, if you need to do something specific for one platform versus 00:40:44.820 --> 00:40:48.760 another, that layer, you can make a decision on how to do that without. 00:40:48.760 --> 00:40:49.660 That's exactly it. 00:40:49.660 --> 00:40:49.880 Yeah. 00:40:49.880 --> 00:40:52.240 Having to put it all over the place, right? 00:40:52.480 --> 00:40:52.660 Yeah. 00:40:52.660 --> 00:40:55.800 So I render onto the segments and that's platform independent. 00:40:55.800 --> 00:41:01.520 But there's another bit of code which will convert those segments onto the appropriate format 00:41:01.520 --> 00:41:02.280 of the platform. 00:41:02.280 --> 00:41:07.440 And the platform might be the number of colors that's supported by terminals because some will 00:41:07.440 --> 00:41:09.760 support 16.7 million colors. 00:41:09.760 --> 00:41:13.220 Some will support 256 and then some will support 16. 00:41:13.220 --> 00:41:13.520 Yeah. 00:41:13.520 --> 00:41:18.560 But because of that intermediate layer, I can make sure that no matter what you write, we'll 00:41:18.560 --> 00:41:21.000 work on the terminal on the given platform. 00:41:21.000 --> 00:41:21.340 Yeah. 00:41:21.340 --> 00:41:21.920 Fantastic. 00:41:22.320 --> 00:41:27.560 One of the things I do want to circle back to is this idea of you're taking a year off 00:41:27.560 --> 00:41:32.980 to continue to work on this project, to grow it even further and already has and also do 00:41:32.980 --> 00:41:34.840 other things in this general realm. 00:41:34.840 --> 00:41:38.280 And so there's a couple of ways which people can support you, right? 00:41:38.280 --> 00:41:44.880 If you're a large bank that depends on this kind of stuff, one of the good options is Tidelift, 00:41:44.880 --> 00:41:45.180 right? 00:41:45.180 --> 00:41:49.900 People can get a Tidelift subscription for Rich and that gives, what do they get with that? 00:41:49.900 --> 00:41:54.420 So I don't think you get a subscription for Rich per se, but you can get a Tidelift subscription. 00:41:54.420 --> 00:41:54.840 I see. 00:41:54.840 --> 00:42:00.660 And that means that that money is divided amongst all the open source projects that you use that 00:42:00.660 --> 00:42:02.520 are signed up to Tidelift. 00:42:02.520 --> 00:42:10.560 In return, you get more responsive developers and developers which will handle security issues, 00:42:10.560 --> 00:42:11.280 et cetera. 00:42:11.280 --> 00:42:16.920 It takes the risk of open source code for big organizations because there is a little bit of 00:42:16.920 --> 00:42:21.600 risk in that if you're relying on someone's hobby project, are they going to be around in 00:42:21.600 --> 00:42:22.740 six months to your time? 00:42:22.740 --> 00:42:23.020 Yeah. 00:42:23.180 --> 00:42:29.680 So Tidelift ensures that developers will be around in the future to support your code 00:42:29.680 --> 00:42:30.240 going forward. 00:42:30.240 --> 00:42:30.760 Absolutely. 00:42:30.760 --> 00:42:33.120 The other one is right up at the top here. 00:42:33.120 --> 00:42:36.880 I could click sponsor and then come over here. 00:42:36.880 --> 00:42:39.940 Also, that pulls up a link to the external funding for Tidelift. 00:42:39.940 --> 00:42:41.160 But I could hit sponsor. 00:42:41.160 --> 00:42:43.940 Do you have like plans or anything like that? 00:42:43.980 --> 00:42:49.520 I know some projects have, you know, there's like a gold sponsor and here's just a sort 00:42:49.520 --> 00:42:50.960 of keep it going sponsor. 00:42:50.960 --> 00:42:51.260 Yeah. 00:42:51.260 --> 00:42:53.780 Do you have anything like that or is it just, you know, what people want? 00:42:53.780 --> 00:42:55.760 GitHub sponsors supports tiers. 00:42:55.760 --> 00:43:00.100 So depending on how much you want to sponsor, I will help you with your projects. 00:43:00.100 --> 00:43:03.860 I'm always happy to help people actually open source projects. 00:43:03.860 --> 00:43:05.300 Always happy to do that. 00:43:05.300 --> 00:43:12.180 But for the larger tiers, I will do code reviews or I will help you with your project on a more 00:43:12.180 --> 00:43:13.460 more formal basis. 00:43:13.460 --> 00:43:15.280 I might even write code for you. 00:43:15.280 --> 00:43:17.560 It's up to what you want to sponsor. 00:43:17.560 --> 00:43:19.600 If you just want to say thanks, that's very much appreciated. 00:43:19.600 --> 00:43:24.040 You know, if I've solved, if I fixed a bug for you and just want to say thanks, then that's 00:43:24.040 --> 00:43:24.460 fantastic. 00:43:24.460 --> 00:43:29.360 But if you're a company which is benefiting from the work that I do or the work that other 00:43:29.360 --> 00:43:34.560 open source developers do, you can sponsor a bit more to ensure that it keeps the work 00:43:34.560 --> 00:43:34.860 going. 00:43:34.860 --> 00:43:35.320 Right on. 00:43:35.320 --> 00:43:35.560 Yeah. 00:43:35.560 --> 00:43:39.880 And I encourage people if they're depending heavily upon this, you know, help you keep going 00:43:39.880 --> 00:43:43.480 strong, especially as you're transitioning to just working on this. 00:43:43.480 --> 00:43:44.580 So yeah. 00:43:44.580 --> 00:43:47.740 Also, notice someone's forked it since we even pulled it up here. 00:43:47.740 --> 00:43:48.140 How cool. 00:43:48.140 --> 00:43:54.280 So the other, the next step that maybe you would, would take this, you talked about not 00:43:54.280 --> 00:43:58.180 wanting to add too many insane features to rich to keep growing that, right? 00:43:58.180 --> 00:44:02.500 Keep it focused on target is you also have this project called textual. 00:44:03.040 --> 00:44:04.520 Textual is a TUI. 00:44:04.520 --> 00:44:10.020 We've all heard of a GUI, but a TUI is a text user interface instead of a graphical user 00:44:10.020 --> 00:44:10.640 interface, right? 00:44:10.640 --> 00:44:10.860 Yeah. 00:44:10.860 --> 00:44:12.740 I think it's a bit of a misnomer. 00:44:12.740 --> 00:44:16.540 I mean, because the interface is constructed with text, granted, but it's still a graphical 00:44:16.540 --> 00:44:17.460 thing you're looking at. 00:44:17.460 --> 00:44:17.720 Yeah. 00:44:17.720 --> 00:44:17.940 Yeah. 00:44:17.940 --> 00:44:22.080 I think of it as a GUI, but with kind of like a fairly retro aesthetic. 00:44:22.080 --> 00:44:22.660 Yeah. 00:44:22.660 --> 00:44:25.300 It does have a bit of a retro aesthetic. 00:44:25.300 --> 00:44:28.740 I would say maybe if you built something with like Colorama or something, that would be maybe 00:44:28.740 --> 00:44:30.520 more TUI-esque, right? 00:44:30.520 --> 00:44:35.060 Where there's, where you look at what you build with textual, it's got scroll bars, it's got 00:44:35.060 --> 00:44:37.480 banners, it's got icons. 00:44:37.480 --> 00:44:41.280 It's, it's closer by far. 00:44:41.280 --> 00:44:43.240 Looks a bit more, a bit more graphical. 00:44:43.240 --> 00:44:43.680 Yeah. 00:44:43.680 --> 00:44:44.280 Yeah. 00:44:44.280 --> 00:44:47.840 So tell us about textual and why not just more features on Rich. 00:44:47.840 --> 00:44:50.600 Rich has some kind of dynamic features. 00:44:50.600 --> 00:44:54.980 There are progress bars and they're updating live dashboards. 00:44:55.380 --> 00:45:01.120 And I've been asked quite, quite a lot if I could add keyboard support and mouse support. 00:45:01.120 --> 00:45:08.020 And I've resisted for quite a while because I want to keep the focus of Rich onto just generating 00:45:08.020 --> 00:45:09.660 mostly static output. 00:45:09.660 --> 00:45:16.420 But then, then I saw a project called GH top, which is kind of like H top, but it would take 00:45:16.420 --> 00:45:21.580 information from the GitHub API and it would show you like real-time events. 00:45:21.580 --> 00:45:23.780 And they used, oh, there we go. 00:45:23.940 --> 00:45:25.220 And they used Rich for that. 00:45:25.220 --> 00:45:28.600 And when I saw that, I realized, oh, I've got to do this. 00:45:28.600 --> 00:45:30.440 There's a lot of potential there. 00:45:30.440 --> 00:45:36.520 And I put it off a little bit, but then, then I started on it and I kind of realized that, 00:45:36.520 --> 00:45:39.220 yeah, there's quite a lot you can do with a terminal these days. 00:45:39.220 --> 00:45:40.880 This is one of the things that blew my mind. 00:45:40.880 --> 00:45:45.140 Maybe, you know, give us a sense of, I'm trying to pull a particular picture. 00:45:45.140 --> 00:45:47.380 Maybe this is just one I could sort of leave on the screen. 00:45:47.380 --> 00:45:54.460 But one of the things I remember from my early days of GUI type development is how do you 00:45:54.460 --> 00:45:55.920 resize stuff on the screen, right? 00:45:55.920 --> 00:46:00.660 So I want to put something where like the main window is here, but then I want the status 00:46:00.660 --> 00:46:02.600 bar thing, but I want it to stick to the bottom. 00:46:03.040 --> 00:46:04.660 And then I want some other stuff on the left. 00:46:04.660 --> 00:46:08.940 And it sounds like that would be pretty tricky to just dynamically try to generate with Rich. 00:46:08.940 --> 00:46:13.000 But with Textual, you can say like this thing docks to the left and this docks to the bottom. 00:46:13.000 --> 00:46:14.540 And here, this fills the main content. 00:46:14.540 --> 00:46:19.960 And then those bits in the middle, are those basically rendered either more of these containers 00:46:19.960 --> 00:46:20.600 and these widgets? 00:46:20.600 --> 00:46:22.060 Or is that Rich directly? 00:46:22.060 --> 00:46:25.220 Or give people a sense of like what they build with this. 00:46:25.220 --> 00:46:31.460 So Rich does the rendering, which is responsible for getting stuff onto the screen, but Textual 00:46:31.460 --> 00:46:33.380 handles the dynamic stuff. 00:46:33.380 --> 00:46:37.420 At the most atomic layer, there's something called a widget. 00:46:37.420 --> 00:46:41.260 And a widget is almost like a software component in itself. 00:46:41.260 --> 00:46:43.480 It's built on AsyncIO. 00:46:43.480 --> 00:46:48.380 So each widget has its own AsyncIO task and it's constantly processing events. 00:46:48.380 --> 00:46:55.340 And Textual will change the size of that and change the layout in response to resizing the terminal. 00:46:55.340 --> 00:47:02.800 And you can tell it how the widgets fit together within the given dimensions of the terminal. 00:47:02.800 --> 00:47:03.200 Right. 00:47:03.200 --> 00:47:07.500 So you've got like the layout elements that handle docking and whatnot. 00:47:07.500 --> 00:47:08.040 Yeah. 00:47:08.040 --> 00:47:08.180 Yeah. 00:47:08.180 --> 00:47:08.820 Yeah. 00:47:08.820 --> 00:47:09.260 Very cool. 00:47:09.260 --> 00:47:14.580 So one of the examples you have on the Textual readme is building one of these widgets. 00:47:14.580 --> 00:47:16.500 So you just create a class that drives from widget. 00:47:16.500 --> 00:47:21.260 Here you have a hover example and it has a way to render itself. 00:47:21.260 --> 00:47:27.540 And then it very much like traditional, you know, I'm thinking of building like VB6 apps 00:47:27.540 --> 00:47:31.420 or Windows Forms apps, like these traditional ones where you have drag and drop widgets. 00:47:31.420 --> 00:47:32.920 They have these events, right? 00:47:32.920 --> 00:47:37.020 And one of the events here, you wouldn't think of this as a terminal thing. 00:47:37.020 --> 00:47:43.580 You've got like, you know, on mouse, you know, on enter, on leave and, you know, mouse over 00:47:43.580 --> 00:47:45.160 and things like that. 00:47:45.160 --> 00:47:45.360 Right. 00:47:45.360 --> 00:47:52.900 Like those are regular UI types of interactions that you would not expect to see in a text-based 00:47:52.900 --> 00:47:53.300 app. 00:47:53.300 --> 00:47:53.600 Right. 00:47:53.600 --> 00:47:53.940 Yeah. 00:47:53.940 --> 00:47:54.680 That's fantastic. 00:47:54.680 --> 00:48:00.460 It's based partially on my knowledge of writing desktop applications, which is quite old now. 00:48:00.460 --> 00:48:00.980 Oh yeah. 00:48:00.980 --> 00:48:01.880 What did you write them in? 00:48:01.880 --> 00:48:03.000 WX widgets mostly. 00:48:03.000 --> 00:48:03.520 Yeah. 00:48:03.740 --> 00:48:05.620 It's a C++ framework. 00:48:05.620 --> 00:48:07.900 I think it's got a Python layer. 00:48:07.900 --> 00:48:08.320 Yeah. 00:48:08.320 --> 00:48:08.440 Yeah. 00:48:08.440 --> 00:48:08.520 Yeah. 00:48:08.520 --> 00:48:09.400 There's WX Python. 00:48:09.400 --> 00:48:13.180 I think that might be the next, the Python wrapper. 00:48:13.180 --> 00:48:13.620 That's right. 00:48:13.620 --> 00:48:13.840 Yeah. 00:48:13.840 --> 00:48:16.940 But in the last 10 years, I haven't done any desktop applications. 00:48:16.940 --> 00:48:18.380 I've been working mostly in the web. 00:48:18.880 --> 00:48:24.580 So it's mostly influenced by web development with modern frameworks, particularly Vue, which 00:48:24.580 --> 00:48:25.780 I've used a few times. 00:48:25.780 --> 00:48:26.280 Vue's nice. 00:48:26.280 --> 00:48:26.500 Yeah. 00:48:26.500 --> 00:48:27.220 Vue's very nice. 00:48:27.620 --> 00:48:32.980 So I'm trying to replicate some of the best features, I think, of you into the terminal. 00:48:32.980 --> 00:48:35.900 I'm surprised how well some of these features translate. 00:48:35.900 --> 00:48:36.320 Yeah. 00:48:36.320 --> 00:48:37.020 This is incredible. 00:48:37.020 --> 00:48:39.660 It really does build these interactive things. 00:48:39.660 --> 00:48:43.200 Now, another thing to talk about is how do you control the look and feel, right? 00:48:43.200 --> 00:48:48.000 Like the way you might do it in Rich is you might have one of these console markups or markdown, 00:48:48.000 --> 00:48:50.340 or you could use a console and set a style. 00:48:50.340 --> 00:48:58.600 But if you're inspired by the web, you know, like dot main container hash thing I want to 00:48:58.600 --> 00:48:59.180 style, right? 00:48:59.180 --> 00:49:01.240 Like it's some sort of CSS selector, right? 00:49:01.240 --> 00:49:01.660 Yeah. 00:49:01.660 --> 00:49:02.760 So you've read my mind. 00:49:02.760 --> 00:49:06.120 I've been last few days working on CSS. 00:49:06.120 --> 00:49:06.720 Okay. 00:49:06.720 --> 00:49:09.060 It's going to work very much like... 00:49:09.060 --> 00:49:11.840 Is it actual CSS or CSS-like stuff? 00:49:11.840 --> 00:49:12.900 Like what do you have in mind here? 00:49:12.900 --> 00:49:14.160 It's probably not actual CSS. 00:49:14.160 --> 00:49:16.940 A lot of the stuff just wouldn't apply to terminal. 00:49:16.940 --> 00:49:17.160 Yeah, it makes sense. 00:49:17.160 --> 00:49:17.340 Sure. 00:49:17.340 --> 00:49:18.880 But essentially, it's the selectors. 00:49:19.020 --> 00:49:26.100 So I will have selectors where you can select an ID and then a child with a class name, 00:49:26.100 --> 00:49:26.880 et cetera. 00:49:26.880 --> 00:49:29.660 I mean, that's basically what I was thinking when I was saying real CSS, right? 00:49:29.660 --> 00:49:30.260 Like is it... 00:49:30.260 --> 00:49:30.360 Right. 00:49:30.360 --> 00:49:37.320 Or will I say like hash container dot children type and I would write that or is it like... 00:49:37.320 --> 00:49:38.180 It's exactly like that, but it's... 00:49:38.180 --> 00:49:39.040 Exactly like that. 00:49:39.040 --> 00:49:39.420 Yeah. 00:49:39.420 --> 00:49:39.820 Oh, beautiful. 00:49:39.820 --> 00:49:41.940 And the only thing that differs is the... 00:49:41.940 --> 00:49:42.900 I don't know what you call them. 00:49:42.900 --> 00:49:46.260 The bit that goes inside the curly brackets, the actual rules, they will be different. 00:49:46.260 --> 00:49:46.580 Sure. 00:49:46.580 --> 00:49:47.200 Yeah, yeah. 00:49:47.400 --> 00:49:47.580 Yeah. 00:49:47.580 --> 00:49:51.320 They render different things, but very much like CSS. 00:49:51.320 --> 00:49:54.420 If you come from the web, you see this, you'd be very much at home. 00:49:54.420 --> 00:49:54.820 Nice. 00:49:54.820 --> 00:50:00.520 I could probably even use less and transpile that down to CSS and put the odds... 00:50:00.520 --> 00:50:00.900 Yeah, maybe. 00:50:00.900 --> 00:50:01.340 Who knows? 00:50:01.340 --> 00:50:02.200 Yeah, maybe. 00:50:02.200 --> 00:50:06.320 I was thinking, should I just do CSS, which is hard enough in itself? 00:50:06.540 --> 00:50:10.980 Or should I try to implement less or SAS or one of these things? 00:50:10.980 --> 00:50:13.760 Well, I'm going to try CSS first of all. 00:50:13.760 --> 00:50:19.980 If you get it working with CSS, then you probably can get the less compiler to generate the right CSS out of it somehow. 00:50:19.980 --> 00:50:20.760 Yeah, maybe. 00:50:20.760 --> 00:50:26.720 But actually, one of the worst things I think of JavaScript and web app development is all those pre-processors. 00:50:26.820 --> 00:50:27.160 I know. 00:50:27.160 --> 00:50:29.360 I'm 100% with you. 00:50:29.360 --> 00:50:29.700 Yeah. 00:50:29.840 --> 00:50:38.660 When you've got to run all these tasks and all these CLI things just to get it so you can start using your app, it's like, there's something kind of broken about this. 00:50:38.660 --> 00:50:41.140 Can I just include a file here and go? 00:50:41.300 --> 00:50:47.900 It's gotten so complicated that JavaScript is one of the more complicated ways to write code rather than one of the simplest, I think. 00:50:47.900 --> 00:50:48.540 Exactly. 00:50:48.540 --> 00:50:49.260 Yeah. 00:50:49.260 --> 00:50:56.940 There was a time where front-end development was seen as kind of like the baby brother of real development. 00:50:56.940 --> 00:50:58.460 You and your QJ query. 00:50:58.460 --> 00:51:00.960 That's not true anymore. 00:51:00.960 --> 00:51:02.380 I don't think it's been true for a while. 00:51:02.380 --> 00:51:08.680 I think front-end development requires just the same type of thinking as back-ends. 00:51:08.800 --> 00:51:13.440 You've got to organize all these different processes together and mental models. 00:51:13.440 --> 00:51:17.720 And it's actually more complicated because there's so much going on. 00:51:17.720 --> 00:51:19.640 There's so many little things you've got to remember. 00:51:19.640 --> 00:51:20.080 Yeah. 00:51:20.080 --> 00:51:28.400 You're taking so much of modern software development and squishing it down to this narrow little bit that is like run it in JavaScript on the browser. 00:51:28.400 --> 00:51:29.100 Yeah. 00:51:29.100 --> 00:51:34.980 It's kind of got to fit into this historically what used to be like a narrow-focused environment, and now it's definitely not. 00:51:34.980 --> 00:51:35.340 Yeah. 00:51:35.520 --> 00:51:46.380 So I'm trying to take what I think are the good things about front-end development and apply them to the terminal and hopefully leave out the things which I don't like so much. 00:51:46.380 --> 00:51:46.700 Yeah. 00:51:46.700 --> 00:51:47.640 That sounds great. 00:51:48.180 --> 00:51:54.100 So maybe for this one, I think what people should probably do is they should check out the examples, right? 00:51:54.100 --> 00:51:55.220 The examples from Textual. 00:51:55.220 --> 00:51:59.040 They can clone the repo and just run these, and it's super easy. 00:51:59.040 --> 00:52:02.600 There's also a way to see them, I guess, on the developer video log here. 00:52:02.600 --> 00:52:04.280 Are these you doing these videos here? 00:52:04.280 --> 00:52:05.260 That's me, yeah. 00:52:05.260 --> 00:52:08.000 It's just using a short demo of each. 00:52:08.000 --> 00:52:08.520 Nice. 00:52:08.920 --> 00:52:10.260 This is my ad apparently I'm getting. 00:52:10.260 --> 00:52:10.540 No. 00:52:10.540 --> 00:52:11.280 All right. 00:52:11.280 --> 00:52:12.520 We'll not play that. 00:52:12.520 --> 00:52:15.320 Go YouTube. 00:52:15.320 --> 00:52:15.720 All right. 00:52:15.720 --> 00:52:22.760 So, yeah, but people can go and check these out because I think seeing it in action is really what you need to appreciate Textual. 00:52:22.760 --> 00:52:31.000 And it can demonstrate the features which Textual can do, which I don't see in other TUI frameworks. 00:52:31.420 --> 00:52:33.420 I'm thinking particularly of animation. 00:52:33.420 --> 00:52:33.860 Yeah. 00:52:33.860 --> 00:52:37.680 I was just thinking like the CSS easing functions and those types of animations. 00:52:37.680 --> 00:52:38.000 Yeah. 00:52:38.000 --> 00:52:38.440 Yeah. 00:52:38.440 --> 00:52:41.000 I was surprised how well that worked. 00:52:41.000 --> 00:52:46.260 I was animating things at 60 frames a second, and it can go up to 120 frames per second. 00:52:46.260 --> 00:52:50.100 Terminals these days, they're built on the same technology as video games. 00:52:50.100 --> 00:52:56.720 They use hardware accelerated graphics under the hood, so they can actually render terminal updates very, very quickly. 00:52:56.720 --> 00:52:59.280 I don't think people have taken advantage of that. 00:52:59.280 --> 00:53:04.000 How long until someone re-implements Doom on Rich or on Textual? 00:53:04.000 --> 00:53:05.420 I'm sure it's possible. 00:53:05.420 --> 00:53:08.980 You could render it and then, you know, render it onto text. 00:53:08.980 --> 00:53:11.940 I don't know how you do it, but various ways of rendering images. 00:53:11.940 --> 00:53:15.240 So, in theory, you could put Doom in the middle of a Textual application. 00:53:15.240 --> 00:53:20.200 I would say start with really, really small fonts in a big terminal window so you get higher resolution. 00:53:20.200 --> 00:53:20.680 Yeah. 00:53:20.680 --> 00:53:21.080 Yeah. 00:53:21.080 --> 00:53:22.700 But, yeah, you've got the color. 00:53:22.700 --> 00:53:23.640 You've got the emojis. 00:53:23.640 --> 00:53:24.660 I bet you could make it happen. 00:53:24.660 --> 00:53:25.380 Awesome. 00:53:25.380 --> 00:53:25.740 All right. 00:53:25.740 --> 00:53:28.540 Well, we're getting pretty short on time here, Will. 00:53:28.700 --> 00:53:34.880 Anything else you want to sort of throw in about Textual or even Rich before we wrap it up? 00:53:34.880 --> 00:53:38.160 Just to say that I like getting feedback and input. 00:53:38.160 --> 00:53:42.560 So, if you have any suggestions, jump onto Textual discussion board. 00:53:42.560 --> 00:53:44.820 Or if you find any bugs, let me know. 00:53:44.820 --> 00:53:48.520 Or connect with me on Twitter and I'm happy to talk about these things. 00:53:48.520 --> 00:53:48.800 Yeah. 00:53:48.800 --> 00:53:49.220 Fantastic. 00:53:49.620 --> 00:53:52.960 Also, I want to give a shout out to one of your other projects real quick. 00:53:52.960 --> 00:53:53.380 Great. 00:53:53.380 --> 00:53:53.580 Yeah. 00:53:53.580 --> 00:53:55.180 So, this is PAL file system. 00:53:55.180 --> 00:53:57.240 I've been working on that for well over 10 years now. 00:53:57.240 --> 00:54:00.500 I've handed it over to some very talented developers. 00:54:00.500 --> 00:54:05.320 But, essentially, the idea is that there's an abstraction there for file systems. 00:54:05.800 --> 00:54:13.000 So, the same code can write to your disk drive or an FTP server or a zip file. 00:54:13.000 --> 00:54:15.260 And it just all works exactly the same way. 00:54:15.260 --> 00:54:15.520 Nice. 00:54:15.520 --> 00:54:19.100 Do you have, like, cloud format support, like S3 and things like that? 00:54:19.100 --> 00:54:19.420 Yeah. 00:54:19.420 --> 00:54:19.800 Exactly. 00:54:19.800 --> 00:54:20.020 Yeah. 00:54:20.040 --> 00:54:26.480 So, there's an S3 version and there's a Google Cloud version and there's dozens of other implementations. 00:54:26.480 --> 00:54:28.100 Any database stuff? 00:54:28.100 --> 00:54:31.940 Can I, like, treat a table as a directory or something like that? 00:54:31.940 --> 00:54:33.380 I wouldn't be surprised if there is. 00:54:33.380 --> 00:54:35.640 I don't know of any off the top of my head. 00:54:35.640 --> 00:54:42.120 But some people have done some quite creative things where they've made something which is not a file system look like a file system. 00:54:42.120 --> 00:54:42.900 Oh, look at this. 00:54:42.900 --> 00:54:44.520 Dropbox FS. 00:54:44.520 --> 00:54:46.880 Dropbox as a file system. 00:54:46.880 --> 00:54:47.600 Okay. 00:54:47.600 --> 00:54:48.660 That's pretty amazing. 00:54:49.240 --> 00:54:49.360 Okay. 00:54:49.360 --> 00:54:50.800 Here's the index of file systems. 00:54:50.800 --> 00:54:51.340 Let's see. 00:54:51.340 --> 00:54:54.440 We've got application data, FTP in memory. 00:54:54.440 --> 00:54:55.560 Oh, that's pretty slick. 00:54:55.560 --> 00:54:58.260 So, you can read and write files, like, say, for tests and not care. 00:54:58.260 --> 00:54:59.700 Or temp files, maybe. 00:54:59.700 --> 00:55:01.280 Tem files would be fantastic, right? 00:55:01.280 --> 00:55:01.640 Yeah. 00:55:01.640 --> 00:55:04.740 So, you can use temp files and, like you said, for testing. 00:55:04.740 --> 00:55:08.340 So, you can write it into memory without bothering to write it onto your hard drive. 00:55:08.340 --> 00:55:08.620 Okay. 00:55:08.620 --> 00:55:10.160 The multi-file system. 00:55:10.160 --> 00:55:12.540 So, you could multiplex reads and writes. 00:55:12.540 --> 00:55:13.220 That's pretty killer. 00:55:13.220 --> 00:55:13.600 Yeah. 00:55:13.600 --> 00:55:18.680 That's more, I remember correctly, you can layer several file systems. 00:55:18.680 --> 00:55:22.400 So, you could have one to write and then several to read. 00:55:22.400 --> 00:55:26.760 And depending on where the file is, it'll just make it appear like a single file system. 00:55:26.760 --> 00:55:27.000 Yeah. 00:55:27.000 --> 00:55:27.860 A lot of neat stuff here. 00:55:27.860 --> 00:55:30.760 So, you know, people, they got a lot of file reading and writing to do. 00:55:30.760 --> 00:55:31.440 They can check that out. 00:55:31.440 --> 00:55:33.040 Also, I want to give a quick shout out. 00:55:33.040 --> 00:55:35.080 I saw Paul Everett on the live stream out there. 00:55:35.200 --> 00:55:41.360 So, Paul and you dove inside in a more visual way into textual, right? 00:55:41.440 --> 00:55:44.380 So, I'll link to a live stream you all did over there together. 00:55:44.380 --> 00:55:44.660 Great. 00:55:44.660 --> 00:55:44.940 Cool. 00:55:44.940 --> 00:55:45.740 Yeah, that was fun. 00:55:45.740 --> 00:55:46.700 Yeah. 00:55:46.700 --> 00:55:47.100 Awesome. 00:55:47.100 --> 00:55:47.780 All right. 00:55:47.780 --> 00:55:50.760 Well, I think that pretty much wraps it up. 00:55:50.760 --> 00:55:54.940 So, I'll give you the final two questions before we get out of here, though. 00:55:54.940 --> 00:55:59.620 So, Will, if you're going to write some Python code, what editor do you use these days? 00:55:59.820 --> 00:56:00.840 I use VS Code. 00:56:00.840 --> 00:56:02.380 I've used that for quite a while. 00:56:02.380 --> 00:56:03.400 Quite happy with it. 00:56:03.400 --> 00:56:06.120 But I do try other editors from time to time. 00:56:06.120 --> 00:56:06.520 Nice. 00:56:06.520 --> 00:56:12.060 And then, in addition to pip install rich and pip install textual, any other packages out 00:56:12.060 --> 00:56:15.560 there you want to give a shout out to that you think you use some eyeballs and some attention? 00:56:15.560 --> 00:56:16.980 Anything that's impressed you lately? 00:56:16.980 --> 00:56:17.940 I'm drawing a blank. 00:56:17.940 --> 00:56:18.720 There's so many. 00:56:18.720 --> 00:56:20.320 It is hard to choose, isn't it? 00:56:20.320 --> 00:56:21.740 There's a project I saw. 00:56:21.740 --> 00:56:23.260 Can I mention one that uses rich? 00:56:23.260 --> 00:56:23.980 It was quite cool. 00:56:23.980 --> 00:56:24.320 Of course. 00:56:24.320 --> 00:56:24.900 Yeah, absolutely. 00:56:24.900 --> 00:56:26.900 It's called Object Explorer. 00:56:27.420 --> 00:56:29.640 It's a terminal user interface, but it's not. 00:56:29.640 --> 00:56:33.100 I think it's OBJ Explorer, which is quite nice. 00:56:33.100 --> 00:56:39.080 You could create an, you explore a Python object and you can navigate into it in a visual way 00:56:39.080 --> 00:56:41.740 and it will show you the attributes, et cetera. 00:56:41.740 --> 00:56:42.440 Oh, fantastic. 00:56:42.440 --> 00:56:43.700 Yeah, that sounds really fun. 00:56:43.700 --> 00:56:47.820 Is this for like in-memory Python objects or database objects or what is it? 00:56:47.820 --> 00:56:49.240 Oh, in-memory Python objects. 00:56:49.240 --> 00:56:51.240 So, I think it's like a debugging tool. 00:56:51.240 --> 00:56:54.880 It's kind of like, it's a bit like rich.inspect, but it's more visual. 00:56:54.880 --> 00:56:55.780 Okay. 00:56:55.780 --> 00:56:56.640 Yeah, fantastic. 00:56:56.760 --> 00:56:57.660 We'll have to link to that one. 00:56:57.660 --> 00:56:58.360 All right, Will. 00:56:58.360 --> 00:57:00.200 So, thank you for being here. 00:57:00.200 --> 00:57:01.340 This has been really great. 00:57:01.340 --> 00:57:07.280 Congratulations on both of these projects and all the momentum you've gotten. 00:57:07.280 --> 00:57:07.740 Thank you. 00:57:07.740 --> 00:57:08.440 Final call to action. 00:57:08.440 --> 00:57:11.400 People want to check out Rich or Textual. 00:57:11.400 --> 00:57:12.920 Maybe want to support you. 00:57:12.920 --> 00:57:17.500 Whatever else you want to give a final shout out for or call to action before we call it a show. 00:57:17.500 --> 00:57:19.280 Just connect with me on Twitter. 00:57:19.280 --> 00:57:21.500 My handle is at Will McGuggan. 00:57:21.500 --> 00:57:22.360 Say hi. 00:57:22.360 --> 00:57:24.880 I'm happy to talk on Twitter. 00:57:24.880 --> 00:57:25.360 Right on. 00:57:25.520 --> 00:57:27.060 Be sure to put the link in the show notes. 00:57:27.060 --> 00:57:28.220 Thanks for being here, Will. 00:57:28.220 --> 00:57:28.720 Thank you. 00:57:28.720 --> 00:57:29.220 It's been great. 00:57:29.220 --> 00:57:29.660 Bye. 00:57:29.660 --> 00:57:30.000 Bye-bye. 00:57:30.960 --> 00:57:33.640 This has been another episode of Talk Python To Me. 00:57:33.640 --> 00:57:36.380 Our guest on this episode was Will McGuggan. 00:57:36.700 --> 00:57:38.240 It's been brought to you by Shortcut. 00:57:38.240 --> 00:57:40.020 And us over at Talk Python Training. 00:57:40.020 --> 00:57:42.600 And the transcripts are brought to you by Assembly AI. 00:57:42.600 --> 00:57:47.320 Choose Shortcut, formerly Clubhouse.io, for tracking all of your project's work. 00:57:47.320 --> 00:57:50.700 Because you shouldn't have to project manage your project management. 00:57:50.700 --> 00:57:53.500 Visit talkpython.fm/shortcut. 00:57:53.500 --> 00:57:56.260 Do you need a great automatic speech-to-text API? 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